Roberta Davenport

GOLIA: So my name is Julie Golia. I'm the director of public history at Brooklyn Historical Society. It's October 28, 2017. I'm here at Brooklyn Historical Society in Brooklyn Heights to do an oral history with Roberta Davenport. Roberta, thanks for being here with me. And if we can start by you stating your name and your birthday.

DAVENPORT: Yes. Good morning, Julie -- or good afternoon. My name is Roberta Davenport. And my birthday is [date redacted for privacy], 1951.

GOLIA: Great. And let's just start out -- will you tell me a little bit about where your family is from?

DAVENPORT: So my mom and dad are both Virginians, right? And they came up north to Brooklyn, in fact, in the late 1940s and waited. They were on the waiting list for Farragut Houses. They were out in Bed-Stuy, Brooklyn, when they first 1:00arrived but had put in -- my dad was a veteran from the Korean War -- and put in for an application to come into this new housing that was opening up. So they called them in 1950, you know? And so, the family moved in. To Farragut. And pretty much that's where they raised the family, right? But again, like I said, they were originally from Newport News, Virginia.

GOLIA: Did you ever hear stories about what life was like in Virginia before they came up here?

DAVENPORT: Well, Dad was one of six. And his father had land, some land in Virginia. And my father and his brothers were all vets. They all went into the 2:00war. But you know, it was hard. You know, they were sharecroppers still. That kind of experience was there. They had a little, like I said, a tiny plot of land. But life was around church, right, and that dinner table and cooking. So my mom and dad met on a bus. My dad was in uniform. And they were both incredible, incredible people, right? But they made their life north. They really made their life in Brooklyn. And so, occasionally we would go back and forth during the summers. I never went, but my brothers and sisters went. But they pretty much set down roots in Brooklyn, New York, and more particularly in 3:00Farragut, in the Farragut Houses.

GOLIA: Why did they choose to come to Brooklyn?

DAVENPORT: You know, that's an interesting question that I don't have an answer to. So thank you for raising that. My dad was, as I said, one of six. And he was pretty much the person in the family that his brothers and sisters depended on. So it's not that we had family in Brooklyn. But my dad worked for fifty years at the Brooklyn Navy Yard. So I'm thinking that some of that might have been because of the job opportunity. And you know, the shipyard was there. My dad worked on the shipyard. He was a plumber. So that's what I'm thinking. And then the other brothers and sisters followed him up. And he put them up for a while, 4:00you know? Again, he was the one that was solid and dependable and steady and resourceful, you know? Yeah, so it may have been work. It may have been work.

GOLIA: So you mentioned to me that you have many siblings.

DAVENPORT: There are ten, three sets of twins. My mom and dad had ten children, three sets of twins. And my mother was forty-two when she had Sandra, the last one. And Sandra was twelve pounds, fourteen ounces when my mother was -- again, had her at forty-two. But all of her babies were big, right? So her twins, right -- we all weighed at least eight pounds. So she carried sixteen pounds three times, right? She was an incredible woman on many levels. So yeah, we had quite 5:00a family. We had quite a family, a whole bunch of us. So we started out in one building, in 224 York Street. And once we moved into Farragut, then that's when, you know, the numbers started to increase, you know, because Mom and Dad had been waiting for -- to establish a home.

So once that call came, we were in, you know? So of course I'm one of the older children, yeah. So David was first. And then a year later came Roberta and my twin, Rosetta, you know? And we were born in Brooklyn Hospital and came in. So 6:00we originally went into 224 York Street with a two-bedroom apartment. And then as more children came we moved to 233 where we had four bedrooms, you know? Yeah, I had a wonderful time growing up with my brothers and sisters in Farragut. I was the one who was my mother's right hand, so quiet. When I say I had a wonderful time growing up, always safe, always felt safe, secure. My mom was a really great housewife, you know, and raised us with chores. So they were well established in the community, really well known, respected. My mom eventually converted to Catholicism from Baptist because the nuns up at St. 7:00Ann's Church had been so good to her and her family and her kids, you know? And so, she was very much a community person. So she cooked for the priest, right? And we were fully involved and engaged in the community activities -- lots to do for kids, you know?

So we were in Brownies and Girl Scouts and Boy Scouts, and the community center was there, and -- very much a close-knit community. My role within the family was to be the one that my mom depended on to make sure everything was fine when she stepped out for a minute, right? If she went shopping or went to a meeting, then she always left me in charge, you know, which was interesting because my 8:00brothers and sisters were normal, typical kids growing up. And boy, they could get into something. But you could imagine the liveliness of the house, you know? We had parakeets, you know, and so it was nothing for one sibling to let -- and that person shall remain nameless, but would let the parakeet out. And I was terrified. This thing would fly around the house. And so, everybody would have a great old time clapping while I danced around. So you had typical things going on.

But again, this feeling of being safe and secure was very strong, you know, as I reflect, and created a great sense of home. And that's how I know home. My mom 9:00was a fantastic cook. That's one of the reputations she had in the community. So you know, we were all raised strong, strapping, healthy kids, you know? So a typical breakfast for us, any one of us, was four slices of toast, three eggs, you know, bacon, sausage. If we were "poor," -- we were certainly considered socially and economically lower class -- we didn't know it, you know? We had a clean home. My mother was meticulous in her home. People would come in and say you could eat off the floor in Louise's house, you know? And again, we were responsible for chores, so the washing of the floors and walls and windows and blinds, putting out trash, washing dishes, peeling potatoes, the cooking. That 10:00was just how we were raised, you know? So yeah.

GOLIA: Tell me -- take me back to Farragut. What was it like to grow up there? What did it look like? What were the families like? What was the neighborhood around it like?

DAVENPORT: It was almost idyllic -- clean, very, very, clean. You had the city workers making sure the landscaping was done, the area was, you know, free of trash and garbage, you know? It was a mixed community. Lots of different ethnic groups were there. I remember our doors being left open. The kids, you know, in 11:00spring and in summer and fall, everyone was downstairs. You know, Ringolevio, handball, jump rope -- it was wonderful. And parents, you know, and neighbors, you know, looked out for all of the children, not just their own. So it was nothing for Ms. Smith to say, "You know better than that, David," right? And so, there was this respectful relationship between the children and not only their parents but all of the adults, you know?

So the community center, as I mentioned earlier, was a great place. Lots of different activities were going on down there. But there was a sense of freedom and openness -- and very much child-friendly. You know, parents would come down, 12:00and they'd sit on the benches. You know, they'd have their conversations while the children were off playing. The complex itself, as I mentioned, was beautiful, you know, and quite expansive, extensive. So you didn't feel like you were trapped or closed in. You know, shopping was Myrtle Avenue, you know? We'd walk through Fort Green to get to Myrtle Avenue. We'd shop at Bohack's. I remember Bohack's, right? And then Barney's up in the other direction, at the northern end of the property of Farragut, you know, everybody went to Barney's for their heroes, you know?

And the church was there, St. Ann's Church -- a lot of involvement in the 13:00church, you know, weddings, funerals, right, the holidays, you know, being dressed up in our Easter bonnets and white dresses. So rituals were certainly observed, you know? Traditions were established, you know? It was a wonderful life. It was a wonderful life. I have no memories of trauma. And I know how fortunate I am to be able to say that. Not one moment of trauma touched me. I had a mom at home. I had a dad at home. Dad went to work every day. He had an outstanding record of attendance on his job, right? And with ten children, his choice was to stay, right? He stayed, so he was Dad. And that whistle at the 14:00navy yard blew at 4:15 every day, right? So we knew Dad was on his way home.

And Mom was a stay-at-home mom, you know? And they were very protective. They would not allow us to be under anyone's care except if Mom had to step out, I was. But we didn't have babysitters, you know? We were with Mom and Dad. Like I said, as I got older, then -- and when those babies came, you know, it was changing diapers and formula. I mean, that was my job, you know? I remember dipping diapers in the toilet. We used to -- you know, I remember that scrub board, right? And wonderful, wonderful, wonderful meals, you know? My brothers and sisters, we talk about this to this day. The food was so plentiful, you 15:00know? My mom could stretch a dollar, you hear me? But I never knew hunger, you know? My mom and dad never accepted public assistance, never accepted anything from the city or state, right? Everything they did and provided for us they worked for, right? At a certain point, my mom went out and started doing some domestic work up in Brooklyn Heights. And I'd go along with her sometimes. Sometimes it would be a dentist's office or a doctor's office to make extra money, you know? But Dad was the breadwinner, you know?

GOLIA: Roberta, I'm going to adjust your microphone just a little bit, just because I'm picking up --

DAVENPORT: Am I not coming through?

GOLIA: I don't want you to feel inhibited by movement. But sometimes when you move your jacket is pushing.

DAVENPORT: Oh, let me keep still.

GOLIA: Not at all. Everyone should feel free to move as they can. Yeah, that's actually a lot better.

DAVENPORT: Yes? Okay.

GOLIA: So will you tell me a little bit about your dad's work at the navy yard? You said he was a plumber. Tell me more about -- did you get to go to the navy yard at the time?

DAVENPORT: I didn't. I didn't. All I know about my dad's work was that he was a plumber. He was good at what he did because he was offered a promotion to be a supervisor. And he didn't accept it, you know? I think he tried it for maybe a 17:00week. But he wasn't that kind of personality. He wasn't that kind of guy, you know? But his -- the people that he worked with respected him. When Dad came home, he did not talk about his work. My mom did most of the talking. My dad had a sixth-grade education. And yet, he was a man who was a deep thinker. Especially later in life, did a lot of reading on Eastern religion and culture. 18:00He kind of came to his spiritual life after his children had grown, you know, and he was approaching retirement.

So my conversations with my father were limited, you know, because I also was very much, I'm going to say now, an introvert. Whatever I was told to do -- I was a very obedient child. Whatever I was told to do by my parents -- healthy respect for authority, you know, I guess we all had that. But other than that, I didn't talk, you know? I did a lot of writing, kept journals and diaries. But I didn't talk. My twin was effervescent and outgoing and did all of the talking, right? But my dad, he left -- when I say he left, he passed when I was about 19:00twenty-nine. And I often think that I wish I had had the opportunity to talk with him. One thing I remember him saying to me, because he was very observant, he said, "You need to be quiet because you're always busy, always doing something. You need to take time to be still and to be quiet." At the time I had no idea what he was talking about, but I certainly do now, see?

So I love my father and have a great deal of affection and respect for him as a dad, again, who stayed and brought that paycheck home every week and gave it to 20:00his wife, you know? And he didn't go to parties. He didn't hang out. He didn't leave -- home. He was home, at work, or he was home. You know, he liked to watch Meet the Press on Sundays, you know, and the Ed Sullivan Show, Bonanza.

GOLIA: It's interesting that both of your parents had kind of a different spiritual awakening at the end of their lives, right, that your mom --

DAVENPORT: My mom sooner because the closest elementary school to us was PS 9 [Public School 9], right, which was down in, right, in the DUMBO area. But the nuns and the priests, who were Father Manyon [phonetic], Father McKay 21:00[phonetic], had such an impact on her. Dad was off, you know, doing other things. He was working, you know? But Mom was home. And she was raising the children. And Christmas was unreal. It was unreal because the gifts under the tree extended three quarters of the room. Most of that came from the church. So you know, we were all baptized. And as we became school age, she put us in Assumption School, right, until they closed, and then St. Paul. The others went to, you know, St. Paul. But I finished at Assumption School. So you know, church 22:00on Sundays, all of the holy days were observed, you know, fish on Fridays, you know?

So it was the structure and the experience of being within a Catholic school. And the rituals, which I loved, right, were very much important to me. You know, the palms would come home on Palm Sunday. But we didn't have great talks and conversations about our spiritual lives at home, you know? The expectation from my mother and father was get your education. Go to school, get your education, and there was no such thing as you being innocent if any message came from the 23:00school that you messed up, see? You're my child, and you what, you know? Of course it was never me. But my other brothers and sisters -- oh, I did it again.

GOLIA: No worries. I want to go back to school. I want to hear you talk a lot more about school. I want to just ask you a couple more questions about your dad. Was he at the navy yard when it closed in 1966? Was he still there?

DAVENPORT:No, he was gone. No, he had retired. And the Dr. White Community Center was built right under the BQE [Brooklyn-Queens Expressway], right? It's just about across the street, adjacent to the Church of the Open Door. And there 24:00was a settlement house on the corner of York and Gold which is now where the day care center went up. But that was a settlement house. And that's where we went for going to the church. And that's where we went for Brownies and Girl Scouts. So -- I started to go off on a tangent. So what was your question?

GOLIA: It was about the navy yard closing.

DAVENPORT: Yeah. So when they closed the settlement house, they built the Dr. White Community Center, which was going to be a residence for the nuns. I remember sheeting the beds in there. We were very close to the nuns and the priests. And you know, my brothers were altar boys, you know? So Dad, when he retired from the navy yard, he took part-time work at the day care, at the 25:00community center, for maintenance and security. So he left, yes, before it closed. And they also -- my mom and dad, you know, they had middle-class values, you know, like most of their friends and people who come into a project. You know, it's a stop point, you know? So eventually they bought their home out on Macon Street in Bed-Stuy. So we left Farragut, see?

GOLIA: When was that?

DAVENPORT: We left Farragut. Now, I had already left. I was the first child to leave home, go off on my own. So they must have left in, like, '79, '80, when 26:00they bought the house, which was of course a big deal. My father was in a position. I mean, we were -- he bought his first car, his Cadillac, you know? And they moved into a wonderful brownstone. And at that point I think four or five of the kids were still at home, you know? So he passed in 1980. And Mom passed in 1983, right? So I became the guardian of my baby sister, Sandra, because she was a senior at Midwood [Midwood High School] and about to start Tufts in September, right? My mom died in January. So it was an interesting time, yeah. So the family -- again, I had been gone. But the family left 27:00Farragut in '79, yeah, 1979.

GOLIA: Did you feel -- so, you lived there during -- for a good chunk of time. Can you talk about whether you felt like there was -- you saw change in Farragut, maybe due to the navy yard closing? Did you see any changes in the neighbor and people who lived there over the course of the, you know, two decades that you lived there?

DAVENPORT: Well, I started working at about fourteen at the Dr. White Community Center and got involved in programs for kids. So I was tutoring, right, and very close to the activities there. So summer programs, you know, summer youth 28:00employment, I was there. And Johnson was president in '68. And there was a lot of money for college for people like me. So I received what was called a community scholarship and went to Marymount Manhattan College, right, as a result of that. So I went to Bay Ridge High school, right? So once I got into college, I pretty much -- like, a new world opened up for me, although college was very challenging for me because I came out of a very protective environment. 29:00I didn't travel. I'd never traveled. I'd barely been off the block, you know? Life was this community within these ten buildings, right? So you know, we walked up to Assumption School.

[Interview Interrupted.]

GOLIA: Sorry.

DAVENPORT: I remember that I'm attached.

GOLIA: I'm so sorry. [laughter]

DAVENPORT: No, no. It's okay. It's okay. It's wild and woolly here. But -- I think I'm jumping around a little bit -- but --

GOLIA: That's okay. It's great.

DAVENPORT: So I'd never really traveled on the subway. I was really isolated, insulated, you know? So I went up to Marymount. A community leadership 30:00scholarship -- that was the scholarship I had -- that sent us to Marymount on East 71st Street in New York City. And I was in the first cohort. And I had an afro. And when I went up with Janice, Sandy and Wendy, a bunch of us from Farragut went up and integrated Marymount Manhattan College. And you know, it's not until many years later that I can look back and see what was really happening. You know, all of us were absolutely obligated to work with a psychologist, right? We had to go into these circles, these sessions with him. But we understand, you know? At the time, I was like, you know, I'd never -- I 31:00didn't know anything, right, anything about what all of this implied and how I was perceived by a larger society, right? So college was very challenging for me. I had spent so much time in my own head. And there was no attempt from anyone to pull me out of myself, right? So social skills, you know, other than "yes, yes, Ma," "yes, Dad," or, you know, reminding my brothers and sisters -- I have to tape my hands to the table.

GOLIA: No, not at all. In fact, I'm going to --

[Interview Interrupted.]

GOLIA: Okay, we're back on.

DAVENPORT: So they had never seen anything like us, right? So some of the students, you know, were asking to touch my hair, you know? So it was a great experiment, right? I was not a good student at Marymount and had no direction, had no idea who I was, what my strengths were, right? My sister was the star, yeah. I mean, she was amazing. She still is. She's amazing, just very outgoing and fun and highly social. I tell Sandra -- Sandra, David, and Rosetta, of the 33:00ten, superb interpersonal skills, talk to anybody, you know? Apparently, that wasn't me, right? So Rosetta was at Hunter [Hunter College] when I was at Marymount. And I eventually majored in studio art and minored in elementary education, right, by accident, I mean, you know, although I did discover an interest in art through that process. So I met someone originally from Jamaica at Marymount who wanted to travel to see her family in London. And she asked me 34:00to go with her.

So I went home and said, "Ma, can I go to London?" And my mom said yes. So she always gave me complete freedom. My dad always gave me complete freedom, right? And Doreen latched -- she found a connection with me. And so, we backpacked through Europe. I was a junior in Marymount. We went to Milan, Italy, Switzerland, France -- I fell in love with Paris -- and London, and came back changed, you know? This was someone who wanted to be my friend and introduced me 35:00to this brand new experience. So I graduated from Marymount and went back to Farragut and took a job in the day care center that had been built, right, on the corner of York and Gold. And I became a teacher. And I'd been with kids just since I had started when I was fourteen, fifteen. So I was real comfortable around children, all right?

So eventually the people who were running the day care center -- I think the director, Sandy Mann, and Deborah Allen, they were incredible educators, incredible women, you know, very strong. But apparently they saw something in me 36:00because I was invited to apply for the assistant director's position. Now, I still am trying to figure out who I am. I'm really just going through the motions, you know? So eventually I decided to leave but not before enrolling at Teachers College, right? And I was working on my master's and left the day care center and wound up at St. Joseph's Children's Services down on Adams Street, which was a foster care and adoption agency, right? And Dorothy Dougherty [phonetic] was a supervisor in charge of adoption. And I eventually wound up in 37:00her department as a case aide. I had not completed my degree program at Teachers College.

So I've never forgotten her name because she was one of those people in my life who pushed me. She was relentless. You know, I was doing this. She was relentless. Finish, finish, because she wanted something from me. She said, "You have no business being a case aide," right? So anyhow, I finished at TC and was moved to recommend for the home finding department. And then after I'd been 38:00there for a few months, they wanted to promote me to being supervisor of the home finding department. It was an incredible growth period, development period for me at St. Joseph's. So St. Joseph's is and always will be very special in my life because I started to make decisions to understand what it was that I valued. And eventually I realized that the people who were in these helping professions were actually, it seemed, the problems -- not the children and the families, but these so-called professionals did not, it seemed to me, have the 39:00best interest of their "clients" in mind. And this was a five-year experience that I had with them. So I had to get out.

GOLIA: Can you say more about that? Say more. I get that. I get what you're telling me with your eyes. [laughter] But I think it's important.

DAVENPORT: It was significant because my focus was on the children and trauma they were experiencing and what was going on in homes, right, and what was going on with these parents. So when I was working with Dorothy with adoption, part of my responsibility was to work on home studies, right? And so I'd have the opportunity to listen to families. And what was always consistent was the love 40:00that the biological parent had for that child. Now, their behaviors and actions may not show that. But the heart, it was just very clear, right? But having the capacity to have a child, help a child thrive, to love a child and care for a child in the right way was the big challenge. And so, you're trying to make decisions, right, and yet not condemn, judge, to try to understand, make hard decisions, perhaps. And you can't go through that without changing.

But I realized those things matter to me. They didn't matter, necessarily, to some of the other folks that I was working with. It was more about perceived 41:00power, either within the workspace or power over other people's lives and this notion of it's okay, or rather it was the culture to blame, judge, condemn the very people you are being -- you were hired to advocate for, to help, to support. And it ran through. I had -- and again, I've always been one to stay on the periphery, you know? I am not one to seek -- you know, I don't want the spotlight. I've never been one to seek it. But people, it seemed, again, these points along my life's journey, there were people who saw something in me. And 42:00so, the head of St. Joseph's Children's Services was a nun. And she was a lovely, lovely, lovely person. And we would have conversations. Her heart was right. But how do you attract people that believe what you believe, you know? So much dysfunction.

So we had wonderful conversations about possibilities. And she really pushed. So I became supervisor of home finding, then administrative supervisor of the home finding department because she wanted me to become part of her cabinet, right, and be in a position of really talking about policy, right? And so, that was my 43:00first experience with hiring, right? I'm not counting the day care center experience as much as I'm counting the significance of these roles. So I had to find people who had not only the skill and the training but had their own personal sense of ethic and a certain empathy, not sympathy but empathy, because I don't believe in coddling people who are struggling. I don't, right? So it's all what are you going to do about it? Okay, that's the situation you find yourself in. What are you going to do about it? What are you prepared to do? What are your options? Let's talk about that. I can be a resource for you for that. But ultimately this is your life. You have free will. What do you choose 44:00going forward, right?

Right now, your parental rights are going to be severed, right, for these reasons. But again, you know, it's working with people in a very practical way because all of this becomes -- how useful is that? I mean, it is what it is. So mistakes were made. We all make mistakes. So your mistakes led to the point that you're losing the child. So be that as it may, so you have, like, seven seconds to, you know -- and then, let's move on, because to me that's what the so-called client needed, and didn't need anyone to kind of -- what's that word? But 45:00anyhow, they needed a different way as far as I was concerned of thinking about where they are now and the plan for moving forward, because you have a dream. We all carry a dream with us. What's your dream, right? So anyhow, to sit at a table with people who had different motivations, see, you know -- so, I remember now, I said I was leaving.

And Sister -- why do I want to call her Sister Rita? [inaudible] Don't tell me I remember her name. Oh my God. She asked me to stay. I had forgotten this. She asked me to stay. And I think I did three months after that. But I told her I have to go. I can't stay here because the problem is here. And so, because we 46:00were on Adams Street, and the department of education was right there, I'd take my breaks, my lunch break, and go in and do the administrative stuff to get myself ready to go into -- I decided I was going to teach. And by this point I think I was thirty, right? So I wasn't going into teaching, you know, coming right out of, you know, the university. No. I came in.

GOLIA: And you had finished Teachers College?

DAVENPORT: I'd finished Teachers College. So I had my degree. And I met a wonderful man, got married. I got married in -- my mom died in January. I got married the following September.

GOLIA: What was his name?

DAVENPORT: Tim. So Tim and I moved into a wonderful apartment on Clinton Avenue 47:00in Clinton Hills. And I got a job teaching at PS 11.

GOLIA: What grade?

DAVENPORT: So it was interesting because, you know, I went down to the district office. And you know, they said things. And I subbed for a minute, right? And when I subbed at PS 11, I became a regular sub. They called me pretty regularly. So the folks who had been there for a while said, "Don't think you're going to get in here." And they called it the country club. They said, "Because nobody leaves," right? But as it turned out -- poo on you, right? As it turned out, of course, you know how providence works. The principal called and said, "We have an opening. We never have an opening, but we have an opening. The kindergarten 48:00teacher's leaving." The teacher became so overwhelmed that she climbed up onto the desk and started jumping up and down. And what did the little kindergarten children do? [clapping] [laughter] Oh, they cheered and clapped. They loved the show. The woman had to be removed. And that's how I got into PS 11.

GOLIA: Oh, that's a story.

DAVENPORT: Isn't that a story? [laughter] Never say never. You never know.

GOLIA: Oh my goodness. Oh my goodness. Talk about providence.

DAVENPORT: Yes. [laughter] Oh, it's a great story.

GOLIA: Oh, that's incredible. But even -- because, you know, every experience is an opportunity to grow, you know? It doesn't matter how slight, you know, the 49:00activity might be. It's like, wow, how do I prepare to go in every day? I don't know what grade I'm going to have, you know? So I did things. I liked where I was. I liked my approach to things, you know? I wasn't a complainer, you know? But I knew I had to reach those kids because I'm a sub, you know? So we had a wonderful time. I'll just put it that way. We had a wonderful time. And teaching and learning was going on. And the principal, you know, I'm sure he was aware. So he called and I said yes. So of course it was after the school year had begun. I'd had the day care experience, you know? I'd been with kids a long time. So I had a wonderful assistant principal, Eve Douglas. She was wonderful. 50:00And I said I want to learn everything. Teach me everything, right? So let me -- who's the best teacher in the lower grades? I want to go and sit and observe what she's doing.

So I got a lot of support from the assistant principal but went in and learned how to teach. So I had the kindergarten from that year. And then I was told -- oh, I went up. They put me upstairs. I think I tore it down. They gave me a first grade class. They gave me a first grade class. And I was told you have to pay your dues, right? Now, remember, I'm not twenty or twenty-one. I'm old. I'm 51:00thirty, right? And I didn't come into PS 11 expecting or needing or wanting to make friends. I didn't come in to impress anyone, right, or to find a life. I knew exactly what I wanted to do. I want to work with kids. I wanted to teach. And I wanted to be an excellent teacher. So when they told me I had to pay my dues -- these are the so-called teachers -- that meant, because at this particular time they tracked kids in the school. So the language they used -- and this is so reminiscent of what had happened with how kids of color were 52:00discussed and talked about at St. Joseph's Children's Services.

So it was -- you had the bottom. You would actually categorize groups of children, right? But this was happening everywhere. But you have to -- you pay your dues, so you have to have the bottom kids, you know? So I had an immediate reaction to that. So again, the adults are pushed aside. You know, I got the information I needed. So I wanted my kids. So a labor of love, right? Those kids taught me how to teach. But this is where I found my voice, my belief system was developed, building on what had come out of the experiences at St. Joseph's Children's Services. So I would say to the children, "you were given to me, 53:00every single one of you." You were given to me. And I'd stand in front of them and tell them who I was, where I came from, what I had to do to get there, right, and said that you were given to me because I asked for you, right? How many of you think you're stupid? Every hand went up. These are the bottom kids in first grade. They're six. But again, you have to have a strong sense of who you are when you stand in front of a group that's been disenfranchised, even though these were babies.

But the joy that gave me -- see, it didn't make me said because I knew what the answer was. When I asked, how many of you think you're stupid, I knew. But they 54:00gave me my platform. And I mean, what could be more glorious than to stand in front of a group of children and tell them that you love them and that they belong to you and that you chose them. And I told them, I said you're not stupid. You don't believe me yet, but I'm going to show you. I'm going to prove to you how fabulous, how brilliant you are. Now, this is what I need you to do. You've got to come to school every day. You've got to come to school with your tools now, everything you need, because no one had ever told them this. But we want to hold them accountable, though. But no one ever told them -- what does good look like? What does correct look like? How do we do -- nobody ever told them. They just screamed, right?

And so, I had them. I was in heaven. I found my niche. So we rocked and rolled 55:00in that classroom, you hear me? And of course, you know about self-fulfilling prophecies and raising these high standards and expectations. So my kids were successful. So in terms of the parents, I'd call every parent and tell them who I was and say, "look, I'm so happy." "Boo-boo, you happy with Boo-boo?" "Yes, I'm so happy he's mine," right? So but what I did -- and again, you're always paying attention because you learn, right, when you pay attention to certain things. I could see who the parents were who were vested and who didn't have the capacity yet. So for those children who I knew were not capable, I cut them 56:00loose. And that group of kids became my own personal group. So soap and face cloths and, you know, you just do little things because you knew if they didn't get it with me, they weren't going to get it anywhere.

So again, what a great opportunity. Now, I'm not discussing this with anyone. I have no conversations about this with the principals or my colleagues. I close the door. This is our community in this room. So these are the things we want to work on. We're all together in this. We're never going to hurt each other, right? We're not going to do or say anything. If somebody makes a mistake -- because, you know, you watch. And if somebody fell or made a mistake, you know -- so, we're not going to do that. We're going to do this instead. If you see one of your friends falls, you're going to rush. Who can be the first one to 57:00rush over and help pick them up, right? That's what we're going to do for each other. Who had ever told them this before, right? So if someone makes a mistake, well, let's talk about learning. You know what learning is? Smart people make lots of mistakes, yes. How else do we learn, okay?

So I made them a promise. You stick with me, I'll stick with you. And we're going to have a wonderful year. So and we did. And the joy, you know, the joy of seeing brains at work and those eyes light up, and when you give a sincere, "that was excellent," right, not condescending or inaccurate or false, because if it's not excellent I'm not going to tell you. I'm going to tell you that you're close. Now, what happened there? Let's look at what happened there. So 58:00one story -- Candace is at the board. I'm teaching math. And so, my approach to teaching was, boys and girls, I'm going to teach you something new today, right? And it's connected to something we were talking about or working on, right, we've been working on. Or, it could be something -- a brand new concept. I said, so, you're going to have certain feelings as you hear me teach this because you haven't been taught this before. Those feelings are normal. You might feel nervous, anxious, you don't understand. That's normal, right? So we're going to spend about two weeks on this idea, right? And by the time we get to the end of this unit or this thing, you're going to feel a lot better about yourself. And 59:00you will have mastered this material, okay? But remember, you're going to have these kind of funny feelings. Everybody has them. It's okay, all right? Easy, easy, easy. So you're teaching. And I would always ask, "does anyone have a question?" right, because smart people always ask questions, right? So do you have a question? Are you not sure of something? Would you like me to do that step again? "No, we got it." "Okay, okay. Now, if anybody does, let me know."

So what happened is that you create a safe environment in that classroom where children understand the learning process is something that is -- I've lost my vocabulary -- fluid, right? So they were alive and alert and engaged and 60:00helpful, right? So helpful to each other. So if anybody has a problem, just let me know. So Candace is crying because she's a perfectionist. And so I said, "Candace, come up to the board." And meanwhile her friends are saying, "You can do it. You can do it, Candace," right? But you have to build that, right? So anyhow, she comes up to the board, and we work through it, through the problem, step by step. And she works through the step until I can see where the confusion is, right? So then you target the teaching, right? So we go through that, and I said, "so, talk me through what we just did," right? "All right, now you're 61:00going to try the next one by yourself. I'm right here if you need me at any point. But you try the next one." And you know what this all does? This builds confidence, right? So she works it through. "How do you feel? All right, explain to me the process. All right, good. You want to try one more at the board? Yeah, one more." Of course, the tears are gone. So she does it. And then you're ready now to do it on your own, independently. So she goes back to her seat, and she's fine. That's what teaching looks like. But before you can teach, right, the skill or the concept or whatever it is, you have to work on helping children understand that they're valued and worth it. And I'm teaching you because I'm your teacher, and I chose you, and explain to them -- nobody gets it the first time.

Anyhow, that's going into a whole other thing that's very close to my heart. Yeah, it's very, very -- I did it again -- very, very close to my heart. So anyhow, I worked with my babies. And listen, you know, all said and done, parents wanted their kids in my class, right? And the principal came at some point, I don't know after how many years, and said, "I want you to teach the ET class, the Enriched and Talented class." So I had no interest, none, right? So those kids are going to be fine. They don't need me. I want to continue working 63:00with -- meanwhile, they're still tracking, right? I'm going to continue working with the kids -- I used to call them the throwaway kids because, of course, while I'm teaching these "bottom kids," I would be the teacher that they would send all of the problem kids to, right? And of course, when they came into my classroom they were not problem kids at all. They became part of that classroom community.

And I'm not going to say that some of these kids didn't have issues. They certainly did, right? But then you see the need for community services, right? Who needs the clinical social worker or the psychologist, right, or speech therapy, right, physical therapy, right? None of that was real. If any of those services were there, none of that was child-centered, right? And so, you do what 64:00you do in the classroom, really working on making children feel, first of all, that there are structures and expectations, right? Because kids really want to know, how was it supposed to work, right, and to make sure that there's some consistency. With the consistency, routines, and structures you create security, right? Predictability, right? So a friend said to me when I was discussing this with her, she said, "Well, you might want to think about this." She said, "Who's to say that you cannot have an impact on those children who are in this ET class," right? This is what good friends do. They challenge you, right? They push you. But I meant what I said, that these kids are going to be fine. They don't need me, you know? They have strong support at home. They have teachers 65:00who, even though I don't think they taught properly either -- but anyhow, in talking to my friend Annabelle, she gave me something to think about.

So I told the principal one year that I would try it. And I started teaching these kids. And they were incredible, absolutely incredible -- wonderful, wonderful experiences with them. Are you familiar with the concept of looping? So looping is you work with a group of children for one year, and then you loop with them. You take them up. So I was teaching second grade, I think, at the time, and looped, and so took that same group up to the third grade, right? And 66:00the parents, of course, were insistent, right? Every parent wanted their child in Ms. Davenport's class. I still have, you know, Hassan Patterson [phonetic]. When I got to 307 as the principal, somehow she found me. And she said, "Hassan is Poly Prep, Poly Prep." And in the application, one part of it asked, "Who were the influences in your life?" So she said, "I wanted to call and tell you that." And she sent me what he wrote. But in so many words it was, Ms. Davenport, because she made me believe I could do anything. So it wasn't that she taught me long division, you know what I mean, or how to write a proper essay.

And so, I accomplished what I wanted. That's what I wanted. She made me believe that I could do anything, see? I remember I did a lot of projects with kids. And we were doing a unit on birds. We were studying birds. And we had studio in the school and this wonderful artist, teaching artist, Tim Casey. And he and I did a collaboration, and he was an amateur bird watcher. And so, we'd do the thing with the museum. You know, they had the whole aviary piece there at the Museum of Natural History. You had Central Park across the street. And it was just an amazing, amazing project for the kids. But I remember taking them out into the schoolyard, and we had collected -- I had collected all of these toilet tissue rolls. And we made these binoculars. And these -- because they believe everything you tell them, right? And they would go out with these fake binoculars and search the skies, you know, looking for, you know, these variety of birds to see if they could identify them and stuff. It was such a blast. We 68:00had such a good time.

But eventually, you know, the principal moved on. Another principal came in. And she came in in January. And she was the first educator I had ever met that believed in kids. It was an honor and a privilege to work with this woman, Viola Abbott. And they hated her. They hated her. They hated her. And she had steel in her spine because she came in saying schools belong to children, not adults. Schools belong to children. And she'd walk into my classroom. And see, I was 69:00funny in that I didn't care who walked in my classroom. No one became more important than my students, no one. So she would come -- sometimes I'd put them to work, right? So she'd come in, and she'd stand in the corner with these half-sunglasses on. And she'd just watch. So eventually she came and said, "You think everybody in this building is doing what you're doing," which to me was silly because I had not one iota of interest in what anybody in that building was doing. I knew who was there for kids and who wasn't, right? So my response to her -- no, I don't know, you know?

So then she said, "I need you. I need you to come out," because she was coming -- she came into a really hostile, toxic environment. And she was looking for her people. So she was actually going to the building looking for people who believed what she believed about kids. So she wanted me to be a staff developer, right? I had no interest in working with adults. I don't even like adults, right? I wanted to work with kids. But she asked me, God bless her. So I eventually said yes.

GOLIA: How did she convince you?

DAVENPORT: Talking about kids. She said, "You can have an impact on more kids if you can get teachers to believe what you believe, to see what you believe," right? And I saw -- that made sense to me. But again, remember, I lack social 71:00skills, [laughter] you know? I don't have a lot of patience for foolishness, you know? And adults to me were very foolish, especially when you had kids on the premises, you know? And I also saw that the other side of the coin was I believe she was entitled to support. I didn't want her to be isolated in her commitment to what she wanted to do, you know? And that resonated also. So I said yes and became a Title 1 Staff Developer, right?

GOLIA: Were you not -- did that mean you weren't teaching? Or were you doing that in addition?

DAVENPORT: No, I was not teaching because, you know, she's coming in as a new 72:00principal. She came out of middle school. This was in elementary school. And you know, she believed, which is a leadership point, you know, that you surround yourself with competent people, you know? And those who have a particular talent or skill that you yourself as a leader may not have, right, so you want to -- so she was looking for her people. And she found a couple of us, yeah? So I said, okay. And then you know, at this point she was recommending that I go back to school for administration and supervision. And that's when I turned and ran in the opposite direction, right? But she -- Dorothy Dougherty -- I'm telling you, there were people in my life who really saw something and pushed. She was 73:00relentless, too. She would not let me not.

So I applied to the Principals Institute of Bank Street, right? And Dr. Lester Young, my superintendent, wrote -- you know, you never know how people see you until, you know -- but he wrote something that just stunned me. But anyhow, I went to the Principals Institute of Bank Street while I was in training to become a staff developer, right? So a lot was happening at this time. And so I finished Bank Street. This is when I actually interned at Carmen Farina's school. She was the principal of PS 6 at the time. And she was on the faculty of the Principals Institute. And it was an amazing experience to be working under 74:00her and be spending time in her school, you know, as a principal.

GOLIA: Roberta, what year-ish were you at the Principals Institute?

DAVENPORT: So this must have been around 19-maybe-86. Yeah, I think I came out in '86. Yeah, I came out, I think, in '86. So in the meantime, as a classroom teacher I was always interested in developing as a teacher. So I would take myself -- I'd read the bulletin boards. And if I saw a really good training session on something that interested me -- and I was really interested in 75:00reading, right -- I would go, you know? And if the district didn't send me, I'd take myself. I'd pay my way. So Richard C. Owen had a group, a series of sessions that he had set up that I was very interested in. So it was, like, for a week. And it was, like, $150. So I went. And it knocked me out. I'd never heard anything like this. This was when Mary Clay and Barbara Sherman was -- I'd never heard of these women. And to look at the work that Mary Clay was doing -- So usually I sit in the back. I moved to the front seat, front row. And my whole perception of teaching and learning, my understanding, just deepened. And I was 76:00in love. And I never do this. But I went up to Richard at the end and said this is transformative. And he offered me a job. So --

GOLIA: As what?

DAVENPORT: So what Richard did was he had an organization of trainers, of facilitators. And they traveled the country with this approach to teaching, reading and writing, listening and speaking, all right? And it was a rigorous training course. I mean, once you get in, I mean, to me it was like a PhD program. But that's how -- it was the science, you know? And a lot of this was 77:00influenced by the work of Dr. Mary Clay, who was a developmental psychologist out of New Zealand. It changed my life, right? So I did that for a summer, right? So I did this. I have to remember how long. But I did this for a while -- again, transforming. In the meantime, the superintendent in District 13 has decided he's going to bring in an innovation called Reading Recovery. And Reading Recovery was developed by Mary Clay specifically for those children in first grade who fall behind in reading and writing. They can be identified that early.

And then a clinical approach is taken to six to twelve weeks, right, four, four to twelve weeks, with this intensive thirty minutes, thirty minutes a day. Kids will reach the average of their class, right, by the first grade. Now, this is what I had been introduced to when I worked with Richard. And so, Reading Recovery came -- wow. And so, Dr. Young hired me to bring in Reading Recovery to District 13, right? So there is a committed structure for this. No matter where you find Reading Recovery in the world, there's a certain set of expectations that must be in place. And one of that, you know, it's the one-way mirror, 79:00right? And so, PS 9 was selected as the training site. I was going to be the trainer, right? So I spent a year and a half at NYU. Dr. Jane Ashdown, Dr. Jane Ashdown, that's where Reading Recovery was in the New York City area. So this was post-master's, right? So this was department of teaching and learning at NYU. And it was a rigorous course of study because you had to become certified in order to be a trainer with Reading Recovery. So anyhow, meanwhile I had to facilitate this building of this training site and then get the recruitment but get this up and running and working in collaboration with the folks in Reading 80:00Recovery at NYU.

GOLIA: But you're employed by the DOE [Department of Education]?

DAVENPORT: It's the DOE. It was a district-level position. But I didn't have to be in the district office, see? I was housed in PS 9. And so, it was so exciting. It was so wonderful. I had seen the power of this thing. And so, I would -- at one point I was saying it's the best job I ever had because you'd take these children and identify them in such an accurate, precise way so that you can pinpoint what was causing the lack of progress as a reader. And it was 81:00just so cerebral, satisfyingly so. But then the application of it in the clinical -- because, again, the work and the training had to do with training teachers, teaching behind the glass. And those who are in training observing that lesson, that thirty-minute lesson, which is tightly structured, and then the discourse around that, the analysis around that. And then the teacher who taught comes in and gets feedback from the group. So in training, I had to experience that at NYU. You talk about powerful learning? It was good stuff. And I said, yay, it's coming to District 13, you know? There was such a need. Mary Clay is one of my heroes, one of my heroes -- great, great, great work.

So I was there happy, I think, three years, trained all the folks in District 82:0013. And then Vi Abbott -- do you remember Vi Abbott? Vi Abbott was the principal who came in in January and said, "I need you." Well, she called and said, "I need you." No, no. She was the principal there, and she needed an AP. Absolutely not. She said, "You owe me."

GOLIA: And she's still -- and she's at 11?

DAVENPORT: To this day?

GOLIA: No, no.

DAVENPORT: Yes, yes. She's the principal now at 11. So even though I'd finished the Principals Institute of Bank Street, I had no interest in being an administrator, right? I like teaching, right? So anyhow, she got me. She got me. But what happened is, you know, it was such a commitment I had made to Reading Recovery and to building, you know? And it was so successful, successful in 83:00terms of the impact it was having on children that we were serving through that program, right? You saw the power of this intervention. The district then had to find another trainer. And it takes a year -- not a year and a half, a year of training at NYU. So I recommended one of the teachers who was in my first group as the person to come behind me. But that meant I had to hold on to that position for a year as I was still -- as I became the assistant principal at PS 11.

GOLIA: So you're doing both?

DAVENPORT: Yes, and in the meantime running a summer program at PS 11 because Vi 84:00wanted me to work with the teacher, those particularly in the early childhood program, in training them. So anyway, it was a lot going on. But you know, it was wonderful. You had all these great opportunities. So I came in in September. And then at the end of that year Vi left to go up to the district office to be deputy superintendent, right? And a new person came in as the principalship, for the principalship. And I knew it was time to go.

GOLIA: So when is this? Is this close to '90?

DAVENPORT: Yes, yes.

GOLIA: Why was it time to go?

DAVENPORT: Because I had spent so much time in education by this point and had a 85:00certain belief system. And I understood that everyone did not share my belief system, you know? And so, with the new principal coming in, she was entitled to run her school based on what she believed. And so, it was time for me to go. And I was due to see someone about taking on interviewing for the early childhood director's job in District 13. And the same day I fell and broke my foot. I was breaking up a fight at lunch with my third graders. And I was assistant principal at PS 11. And I think I -- some peas or something. Anyhow, but I went 86:00up and came down and broke my foot. And so, I never made it to that interview. But what happened, you know, it was time to do a little bit of soul searching. And so, okay, Roberta, what's next? So I was looking through one of the professional publications, Education Week. And I saw listed in the back that someone was looking for a headmistress to open an independent school in Stamford, Connecticut. So I went for it, you know? I got in contact with the person, and we met at the oyster bar at Grand Central Station. I think by this time I was on just a cane. I'd gotten off the crutches. And we had a wonderful, wonderful conversation. And he said, "I knew as soon as I saw you, you're the 87:00one." So anyhow, that's how I got to Stamford. And --

GOLIA: What was the name of the school?

DAVENPORT: Waterside. A cell phone, a key and a million dollars, that's what he gave me, one million dollars. And he hired me in June. So I had no sense of anything but is this a dream, you know? Wow, this is like -- really? But we opened in September. Don't ask me how. There was no board of directors, right? There was no external governing force. Just, this conversation I would have with the benefactor, right, who was a hedge fund guy, right? And I came to Stamford, 88:00and he took me on a tour of Old Greenwich and Stamford and introduced me to his family, you know, and took me into the Waterside area of Stamford where the school was going to start, you know? It was going to start at a parish, in a parish church hall. And he had a dream. He wanted -- you know, ten percent of kids, of the private schools, independent schools in this country, are in Connecticut, right? And he wanted to open an independent school for children of the working poor, right? All of these independent schools have -- you know, they want to be certified under the independent school charter, right? You have to 89:00have diversity. And none of them, of course, did. They're very, very liberal. And he wanted kids to have a shot, a solid education in the independent schools.

So I actually just wrote my thank you letter to him and mailed it yesterday. And that was thirteen years ago. This was thirteen years ago. I opened Waterside School in September of 2001. And when 9/11 came, he put -- because I had brought up some staff with me from Brooklyn to teach. We started with one pre-K -- no, 90:00one kindergarten, one first grade. He put us all up at his expense, you know? He told me, "If you do this thing, I'm sending everybody to London at the end of the first school year." And of course, we had a successful launch. And so, we all wound up in London for a week, you know? It was an amazing experience. But I didn't know anyone in Stamford. I'd been in Brooklyn all my life, right? He was my connection. He introduced me to so many people, wonderful people, in the independent school community. And they were gracious and forthcoming and generous. And so, you know, we set up open houses, and we opened with, like I 91:00said, a kindergarten and a first grade, eighteen to one, right, eighteen to one, with an assistant in each classroom, right? He gave me a curriculum director and a secretary.

GOLIA: How many faculty?

DAVENPORT: Well, we started with the K and the 1. So there were two classroom teachers. I brought the classroom teachers with me. God bless them, because they took their chance, that risk. And the two assistants were local folks, you know? And so, I commuted, you know, until I decided -- because I was so consumed, you know? I'm all-consuming when I'm working. And so he made sure I was safe. I was 92:00secure, you know? He introduced me to his home, his family. He actually allowed me to stay in the carriage house on his property, you know? But we opened. And it was wonderful. So three years. And eventually a board was established. And so many wonderful things happened. And then I got a call that they needed a principal at PS 307. And of course my first response was, you know -- then I woke up the next morning in 307. I grew up in Farragut, you know? My mom was an aide there. Sandra and Suzanne and Mark were students there. Fanny Porter was 93:00the principal who tried for years to get me to come. When I was over at the day care center she was trying to get me to come over to teach. They'd just built the school. 307, how do you say no? And who called? Who made the call? Vi Abbott, that Vi Abbott again. She said, "We need you."

So I went -- this was hard, though, yeah. I went to the benefactor and told him. He supported me one hundred percent. I have a way about me that I don't look back. You know, it's about some reflection and extracting lessons learned. This is how I work, right, extracting those lessons learned and then move forward 94:00because we are the sum of all of our experiences, right, and then move forward grateful but moving forward. So I stayed because I had purchased a home in Stamford with the help of this remarkable man who had hired me for Waterside School. He made sure that his attorneys took care of -- I'd never bought property before, and seamless, generous, beyond anything I could imagine, you know? And if I had it to do over I would have more formally said what I needed 95:00to say to him about the opportunity, you know? Like I said, I just sent the letter over yesterday after thirteen years. So I haven't had any contact with him since then, no.

But you know, the students that I have, have reached out to me, those students at Waterside School. One called and said he's a freshman at Columbia, you know? It was such a rich, rewarding -- some of it is still a blur because we were building something, you know? And after I left -- because I know who came in, 96:00right? He let me know who they were thinking about to bring in -- they broke ground. And Waterside School is in its own building. It's thriving. Those children are thriving. And I'm not going to impose. I'm using the word impose because it's been a long time. But like I said, I'm very grateful to this remarkable, like I said, individual to have given me the opportunity to have that kind of an experience and an impact on children. So when I left, I kept my home in Stamford but came back to PS 307. And I had never attended 307. I never worked at 307. But so many of the staff at 307 knew my family intimately because 97:00my mother was that kind of a person. So they all knew Louise, Lou, Ms. Davenport. And so, when I got back, it was funny. You know, apparently word got out. And people would come in and say, "I heard there's a Davenport back. There's a Davenport here," you know? So it was quite a welcoming, quite a welcoming coming back because, you know, 224 is directly across the street from PS 307. And that's the building that we all started in, right? I think it was 8A. And so to come back as the principal was quite something, you know? It was quite something. I think it took a while, you know? It just kept building on 98:00what an opportunity here.

And so many people remembered my mother, you know? It was amazing to me. But you know, 307, there was a time when it was touted as one of the most successful schools in District 13, right? A lot of the kids that went to PS 307 came from outside the district. Children of people who worked for the department and lived in Brooklyn had their children coming to PS 307. Fanny Porter, who was iconic with her team, did such an outstanding job with PS 307 that it was considered -- 99:00it was recognized by the state as a more effective school. Over the years, after she left, the school went on a decline. I'm going to loop back a minute to something I shared earlier. When I left to go to Marymount, in the '70s, Farragut began to change, right? I told you it was clean, open -- I mean clean on a lot of levels, open, safe. There wasn't a hint, to my recollection, of any kind of trouble, do you know what I mean? And I mean socially, you know? Now, my 100:00brothers and sisters may have different memories. I don't know if there was any kind of bullying going on. I know I didn't experience any, you know? Everybody was just out having fun and a good time. And I don't remember fights. I guess if there was a fight, if there was a fight, "Oh, fight, fight, fight." But it was so -- but, you know, there were no weapons. It was like, "Who are you looking at?" You know, silly stuff. But you know, in the '70s it started to change. And what, I think, kind of spearheaded it was drugs. So drugs got in. And you know, it decimated Farragut. And it became a very different place. And that was around 101:00the time that my mother and father got out, right? So this had an impact on the neighborhood, on services, right, quality of life, obviously more of a police presence, you know? And people were trying to get out, you know? Many, many, many stayed. I still know people who are still there who were my peers. They stayed, right?

So when you have a series of principals, right, in a relatively short period of time, you know, the impact on a school, right -- and that's what happened to 307, you know? So with all of the social problems that were going on, and then 102:00the lack of consistency and the leadership of that school -- so my predecessor did an incredible job trying to make sure that those children's needs were met. It was huge. I mean, I stayed twelve years, and I still wasn't finished, see? So I started. I came in that summer, and there was a really big break-in soon after. And they said a group of about ten boys got in there. And they tore that place up. I had never seen anything like it. They sawed the fish in half. They got into the custodian's room and got the tools. And every file cabinet drawer 103:00in the main office was pulled out. I'd never seen -- they smashed all the clocks in the -- Kids. They had ordered Chinese food. You had Chinese food everywhere. Someone had taken something and threw it up against the wall. I think they took the door off the principal's office.

So I accepted the job. And you know, the focus was on teaching and learning and test scores and things. And I had this. So that was a wakeup call. That was a wakeup call. So we got a lot of support, right, from the district office. And 104:00then we proceeded to clean up. But you know, the community knew the boys, who the boys were. And the boys were -- they knew who they were. And no one, you know -- so, what does this mean? So you're a principal, right? And so, you have to consider this. So what's the message here? There's a disconnect between the community and the school, clearly, right? Also, the children don't feel that this is theirs because you take care of what's yours, right? And the boys that got in there weren't necessarily students, current students. They may have been former students but not current students, because they knew where everything was, you know? I think they pushed -- they had one of those big televisions on a 105:00stand. They had pushed that off the stage in the auditorium. So I decided that's where we would start, right? So I got representatives from the staff and from parent group. And there's a middle school upstairs, you know? He and I worked really closely together. He was a remarkable educator, Charles. And we met and talked about what kind of school we wanted. And what did the children need, right? So we established a code of conduct and a set of expectations, because one of the things I had learned over my years in education, and especially when you're talking about kids who come out of difficult circumstances that there's very little communication about what expectations are, or how is this supposed 106:00to work? You have to tell kids what is expected because children thrive when there's structure, when you have a predictable environment, you know?

So we knew we had to put some sort of expectations up about this is how school is going to work, right? And then the other part was making sure that I established my relationship with the students. So the PA system became important, to hear my voice over the PA system every day in the morning. "Welcome to school. I'm so glad you're here." "All right, boys and girls," right? "So remember, this is how we do school at PS 307," right? So and then at the end of the day, "Congratulations, boys and girls, on another successful day of school," right? To hear that, nobody's screaming, right, which is, you know 107:00-- or chasing kids, but talking to kids and letting them know that, you know, you're important. This is school. This is a serious place. We're going to have fun. But in order for everybody to benefit, we all have to pull together, right, and know -- we all act in a way that we know is safe for everyone so teaching and learning can take place. So it was important that relationships with the kids were built and then parents.

And so, writing to parents, trying to communicate with parents, realizing that many, many parents, not all, but many won't read the letters that go home, right, for whatever the reason. So you have to look for different ways of communicating priorities and what's important to them, right? Remember, there's 108:00no judging, no condemning and no criticizing. It is what it is. How do we work with this, right, so that there is mutual respect? I used to tell staff I don't care if a parent is crawling in on her belly. That's that child's parent. And so, we help her up and sit here down and say, "Good afternoon or good morning. How can I help you?" right? But everyone has to be respected, right? And for some that was a very difficult concept. You know, everyone is entitled to their belief system. But then, you know, you can also exercise your option and leave, you know? You can find the school that better suits what your belief system is. But this is what we have to do here. So letting the children know they were important, and then really looking at what was happening in those interactions 109:00between the adults and the children in the building, you know, and staff needing clarity on what those expectations are. What are going to be the norms for how we interact with each other in this building?

GOLIA: It strikes me that this is like all the lessons from your career coming full circle. Whether it's St. Joseph's or PS 11 or all the development you did afterwards, it seems like it's all coming together at this moment in your career.

DAVENPORT: Mm-hmm. Isn't that interesting? Yeah. And again, I never saw it, leadership, see? It was always the children, you know, the children. And when I walked in and saw kids running, you know, doing all kinds of things -- but there 110:00was no focus. They were not focused on "I'm a student, I'm a learner, I'm a scholar, you know, I want to be a chef or an explorer or scientist." There was none of that. And yet this is school, see? So because I knew that 307 was not on anyone's radar of importance, if I can put it that way, I knew I could pretty much do anything I wanted to do. I had complete freedom because nobody cared. I used to tell staff the only people who really care about what happens to PS 307 is right here in this building and this community. So I wasn't sad or upset because the bureaucracy of the bureaucratic structure had no interest in 307 -- 111:00over 13,000 schools, 1,300 schools, right? So well, we got this. Well, we got this. We can do anything, right?

So safety first, it's always safety first for me, you know? We have to have a safe building, you know? Kids have to feel safe. Staff have to feel safe, right? So we work on safety. And that's where rules come in. And then boys and girls, there are always consequences to choices that we make. This is life. So school then becomes more than a textbook. School becomes how do we prepare to have a successful life, right, a life of fulfillment? And so, that's why what drove me was always larger than reading, writing and arithmetic, although you will never hear me say reading, writing, and arithmetic are not important. Of course they are, right? But not in order to -- the priority can't be that to pass a test 112:00because tests are everywhere. And there are all kinds of tests. But to get adults and kids to understand that became my mission, you know? You will learn to read and write, right, through the process of education in this building. Character is most important, being on time, being trustworthy and dependable. Being kind is a power, boys and girls. You think it's being weak, but it's not. There's great strength in kindness, all right? So this is what drives me, right? And the other is opportunity, options. How do you know what direction you want to go in if you have limited experiences with what's possible?

So that's why I brought Machiko in, that brilliant violinist, and said play for 113:00the children. They had never seen a violinist before or heard a violinist. You bring them into the auditorium, and you put Machiko there. And Machiko plays, and the children are like -- and then when she finishes, what do you say now? "Who wants to be able to do that?" Not every hand went up, you see, because I brought the second graders down only. But those hands went up. I said, "you will learn how to play violin. Machiko's going to be your teacher," right? So we knew we had to have music, right, so music for everyone. So I go and I find a music teacher, not someone who's pretending to be a music teacher, but who's a licensed, certified teacher of music, but also has a degree in education. Wonderful -- Julia, right? So choir, she has the voice of an angel. We 114:00established -- we gave it a very fancy name because the children -- for the children, so the North Brooklyn Children's Choir at PS 307, right? And you had to audition, right? And boys and girls, you develop a skill or talent to share with the world. So if you're going to be part of choir/chorus, we have to create a venue, then. We must have an audience. And any time you stand on a stage, you never give less than your best. It must be exquisite. So that means practice, right?

And then we start talking about commitment, right? So we started the tradition of spring concert, right, and invite -- we do it twice, for the school community and then for the outer community, right? We start traditions in December with 115:00the choir. And the violin is part of that. Lynn, God bless her. One of the first people who met me when I came to 307 was Lynn. And Lynn is the founder and principal choreographer of the Brooklyn Ballet. And she came and she said, "I want to bring the ballet to the children." I mean, this is what I'm -- you see? They're out there. This is what I'm talking about. So yeah, so she brings in her principal ballerinas. And they get on the stage, and they start. And the children are like this, right? "Who wants to do that?" And so she has the group that face -- the arts are very, very important, you know, and the visual arts teacher, you know, because the school environment -- environment and atmosphere 116:00is very important in the school. It should be clean. So talking with the custodians, school has to be clean, right, clean.

And when I went into the auditorium, when I first came -- we opened in that September -- I told the teachers to bring the children down to the auditorium. I could barely see their faces. There were so many light bulbs that were out. When I went to someone on the staff, the custodial staff, he said the light has been out -- I don't remember the exact number. He said, like, eight years, nine years. I said, "Turn the lights on." Well, it's going to -- turn the lights on, do you know what I mean? So because children live across the street in the project means that this is an environment that's good enough for them? I don't think so. I don't think so. Clean building, plenty of light, bright, airy -- you 117:00know, at the point that I left, this became almost like a mantra. People, anybody who walked into that building would talk about how welcoming, how bright. It just -- everyone spoke about it, right? All of that was intentional, right, starting, of course, with what would be good for kids.

And you know, the opportunity is so great when you think about it that children can come from their home into a place that's orderly, clean, safe, welcoming for those who are not coming from that, see? Not all of them, but those who are not 118:00coming from that kind of home life -- and this is what I would say to staff. This is why it's important to have order, right? So if you want to define "thrive," right, so you want -- it should be predictable. Children should be able to say -- you know, you have children who are giving the tours. "This is how we do it at our school." You have to have predictable. You have to have a predictable environment. You have to have order, right? You have to have a sense of wealth and light and cleanliness. I don't care what your demographic is. Every child needs that. Every child needs that, right? So this was very, very important, environment and atmosphere, you know, and for children to have a 119:00voice and to see themselves in that environment.

So student work, up and according to a certain standard, and helping children to understand we don't put up our least. We put up our best. So if you have three pieces, choose the best. And if you find that you don't have one that meets your standard, then let's work on a fourth, see? So many lessons we can teach, right, in school, if we only let ourselves, right, think about what do the children need? Now, in the meantime teachers are being trained in how to teach reading and writing and math. What does effective instruction look like? We can talk about, right, fair assessment and evaluation. We can talk about all of that. And 120:00all that's happening. But my big thrust was that whole child, you know? I was very much influenced by the work of Dr. James Comer, right, and his developmental pathways. So when you came into my office you would see a little graphic of a child and those six pathways. One of the ways I would evaluate how effective we were as a school was to look at those six developmental pathways and ask how are we meeting the child's intellectual development when we talk about the four-year-old or the six-year-old or the eight-year-old, right? So the six developmental pathways that we really built the school around are cognition 121:00and language. And language is important for our kids, because we looked at both expressive and receptive language, right?

So we've got to get kids talking because a lot of them don't, because they don't have opportunity. We as the adults don't give them opportunity. So language, physical development, very, very important, right? So a physical education program -- not a play in the gym, but someone who's committed to understanding the importance of helping children develop strong bodies -- and so we looked at nutrition and choices of food, you know, and then brought in programs to support 122:00that. So the physical development is important. Of course, the social development of children, people hold some hostility toward poor children. And they use language like they're animals and those kinds of things. But if you look at the need of the child, right, it's an assessment. When I walked into 307, if the children's behavior was inappropriate, to me that meant they had not been taught what was appropriate, given the opportunity to develop that, and then given feedback and recognition -- "good job," see? "What does it mean to be 123:00a good audience, boys and girls," right? "So we don't boo," right? What does it mean to be a good audience? So it's about -- it's teaching. It's about conversation, right? And they're like this. They want to know.

So the social development of children in this high-need school is critical in that there must be -- if you want to call it a curriculum, call it a curriculum. But there has to be approach. And people who work in the school have to be trained in doing what I just discussed. If you're not pleased with the students' social interactions, then how can we get them where we want them to be? First of all, where do we want them to be? How would it look? We recognize what it looked like and then teach that to them because they're all coming out of different homes. Listen, we get what we get. This is who they are. It's our job, see, to 124:00try to teach them a different way, you know?

So that whole social piece, we did a lot of work around social development, including peer mediation and conflict resolution, very, very big. Kalif [phonetic], he was -- we started training kids in peer mediation in third grade. And Kalif was a star. The kids would come, because, you know, you request peer mediation. It's not enforced, right? We're offering this to you, boys and girls, because we know you want to help solve this recurring problem that you're having. It's a social problem. And conflict, we're told, is a part of life. So since we don't do this right or this, but the conflict is still there. So let's really talk about smart ways of resolving conflict. And this is a global, boys 125:00and girls, phenomenon. This is something that everyone wants to look at because there's conflict everywhere we look. And so, we had a wonderful partnership with Morningside Center for Teaching Social Responsibility. And their staff developer would come and train our kids. The kids were told it's 15 hours of training. Who wants to become a peer mediator? Once we presented what this important role was, we put up a chart paper. The chart, I mean, sixty, what, sixty-two names, sixty-three names of kids wanted -- I'm telling you, they're waiting on us. Barack Obama said that. We're the ones they're waiting for. Well, I have a different spin on it. But the kids are waiting for us to figure this thing out and bring to them what's needed. And they're thirsty for this stuff. So sixty-four of them come.

GOLIA: How old were those kids?

DAVENPORT: Third graders, so yeah. But again, it's your school. It's your life. 126:00What kind of school, what kind of community do we want? How do we want to interact with each other? This is so much beyond a standardized test. Again, I'm not saying that's not important. But it can't be the priority. This, what we're talking about, has to be the priority. All that other stuff then comes easier when kids know how to control that energy flowing through their body rather than letting that energy control them. You control it, boys and girls. You know what happens to your body when you get angry, you see? So again, teaching that, because they don't know. And see, no one can tell me that what I'm talking about doesn't work because we have proof of it. Kalif, when he was ready to leave us to go to middle school in the fifth grade, we had the fifth graders -- we always 127:00did a headshot and put up under each what the aspiration is going to be. And for Kalif, a motivational speaker.

Now, I had never heard of a fifth grader wanting to be a motivational speaker. But he, when he was in third grade, took the fifteen-hour training to be a peer mediator, became one of the most popular peer mediators. The kids would come looking for him. We need you to mediate. We have a conflict, right? And I have just a reaction. And the adults don't intercede. We observe him. But to watch this young man help these two little ones work through their conflict with such poise and skill and understanding, this is the impact that schools can have on children's lives. This young man is going to be a motivational speaker. If we 128:00had not brought in peer mediation and conflict resolution, you understand, we have to give them opportunities so they can see what their options are and see what resonates for them. Parents told me that children came home and demanded that they buy them a violin, see? They want to play. If you could have been at the concerts to hear and see these little children from the project play Beethoven on the violin -- how were they any different from the kids in DUMBO? You tell me, other than maybe for some of them the quality of the home life. But they're kids. I had open houses for, you know, recruiting and bringing in. This 129:00is a couple of years before I left. You know, and more and more diverse families started coming in to here and see the school.

You know, we do the tour, and I talk about the school and the direction we were going. And I know one dad said to me, he said, "Are you ready for my wife?" you know? And he was trying to warn me. And my response was, "Is she ready for me?" you understand? This is nothing to be taken lightly. I told all of them, every child who walks through the schoolhouse door is of equal value. That's my response, equal value. So I don't care what the ethnic makeup is of the children 130:00sitting in the seats in that auditorium. I'm going to ask the question, who wants to play violin? If your hand goes up, you play violin, right? If you want to, join the math club. I'm going to ask everybody in the auditorium. Go join the math club, you see? So let's not make this complicated or poison or negative because that's a choice. This is about children. And how do we build a school for children that we can be proud of? And it has to be driven by "What do you believe?" What do you believe, you see? If test scores are important, I would never. I understand completely. I understand completely. I'm not saying test 131:00scores aren't important. I didn't get there yet. We would have eventually. We would have eventually. But I decided to do something different. The last year I was there, our wonderful chancellor came five times to the school. When the mayor was launching the pre-K initiative, he held a press conference at PS 307.

And when these kinds of things happen, do you know what this does for the community? See, it's very important when these kinds of events happen, right? And I always let the community know so they can come because this is you. The mayor decided he was coming because 307 was always designated, as far as I was -- as a community school. This is us, right? And so, the chancellor wanted 132:00someone to speak on behalf of pre-K. And so I went to my Katie Mooney, my fantastic -- one of my fantastic pre-K teachers, right? So just like kids need opportunity, staff needs opportunity, too. I hired that girl, her first job as a teacher -- tremendous growth, right? And so, she prepares a statement, speaks on behalf of all of the pre-K teachers in New York City. And then we won so much money with that magnet grant, you know -- a million dollars, 307. And boy, did we exploit that, right? Science, science, every -- I mean, just transformed this building.

And so, the chancellor came back because they were having a press conference, or they were making -- releasing a statement there was going to be a partnership with Microsoft and the Department of Education and I think another entity. I can't remember what it is right now. And she said, "We're going to meet at 307," right? And again, the children, the chancellor's coming to your school -- yes. By the time the first minister of Scotland came, she was the last visit in June. When the chancellor came, I wasn't needed. The chancellor had been in the school so often that year, she knew. She had been in the pre-K classroom, so she took the first minister and said, "Well, let me show you what they're doing here with the pre-K program." Do you know what that did for my teachers? My children, they don't care. You know, they're just, "hi, hi." We came a long way. We came a long 134:00way -- bright, beautiful, happy place for children. A lot of challenges still, but we'd gotten over a big hump, you know?

GOLIA: That was beautiful. That's why I'm writing it down -- sorry. You're at 307 2003 to 2015?

DAVENPORT: Yes.

GOLIA: It's a period of remarkable change for that neighborhood. So DUMBO, Vinegar Hill, incredible gentrification going on around there, really transforming the fabric and the interactions of the neighborhood. Did you feel like that shaped the school, that shaped the community of Farragut, that shaped the kids? Was that affecting you and shaping your work in any way?

DAVENPORT: Well, you know, I always believed, once I saw what was happening at 307, that we're the ones. See, no one else cares. They still don't. From the first day I walked in, it was always about them. People had the wrong ideas about PS 307 students. Now, that's not my problem, though, see? That's yours. And I would tell, this is not going to affect what happens in this building. I went out and got money because, you know, we never have enough to do what we want. We have enough to pay salaries, right, and do a lot of things. But we have 136:00vision, right? We have some things we want to get done. So we have wonderful partners, right, and significant partners in the community. And one, Jed -- he wouldn't mind my mentioning his name --

GOLIA: Walentas?

DAVENPORT: Yes. You know, he walked in, and I didn't know who he was, you know? Sneakers, jeans, you know? And we talked, you know, education. And he wanted to know how he could help. And it was always about what we believe. And he and I believed in very similar things, especially, I think, about potential. No 137:00excuses, you know, but potential and believing in those kids. He could easily have gone to the other school, right? But he came to us. Yeah, but he came to us. And I remember, you know, because he'd come and visit periodically. And I had a fifth grader. A fifth grader came in the office, and they got to talking, you know? I introduced them. And he asked her, "So what do you want to, you know, what do you want to be when you grow up?" She said, "I want to be a veterinarian." And he said to her, "You continue and do well in school, I'm going to pay for your college education." I'm standing there, right -- pay for 138:00your college education. And he turned to me and he said, "You're going to be the trustee," right?

So but you know, these remarkable people who share in the success of 307 -- earnest, sincere, honorable people. You know he followed through with that. Eventually, he worked that through with -- I put him in contact with the family, see? He would tell me that it was important to tell the story of PS 307, you know? I've always resisted it, you know? But we have incredible stories about the school to tell. But this change you were asking about, I left, you know? But 139:00if I had stayed -- listen, let's keep the main thing the main thing. Dr. Young used to say that. Let's keep the main thing the main thing. And let's also keep it positive. So there's room for everyone, right? What's key is not only having vision but having the resources, having the courage and the discipline to realize that vision. And if you have that -- and I don't believe this is naïve. I think if you have that, I don't think much is there. I don't care how big the 140:00noise gets, how loud the noise gets, how much people, adults, jump up and down and scream, you know, because it's a distraction from what should happen in that building day by day. Keep the focus on the children.

So if you want to bring an issue up, see, then the follow up is, how does that relate to what we're trying to accomplish here in this building for children? If it doesn't, then why are we discussing it? But I'm not there, Julie. People called and said come. They're having these meetings. God bless Reverend Taylor because he came, and he was the voice for the people, right? Just keep the focus 141:00on the children. It's so important. So --

GOLIA: And being at 307 for thirteen years, and then obviously just being more from that community than anyone could possibly be, what do you want people to know about Farragut today, the Farragut community?

[Interview Interrupted.]

DAVENPORT: They want what everyone wants, you know? They want dignity, right? 142:00They want to be visible. They want to be valued, you know? They want to be protected. And they want opportunities, you know? Quality food -- there's no place to get good food. You have to go into DUMBO, you know? We looked at that. There's no place to get decent food, you know? Again, it's a throwaway community. Who cares? There's so much that could be done. It's about leadership, you know? It's so much larger, it seems, than running a school. But it could be 143:00such a wonderful success story because the heart is there. The heart is there. The dignity is there. The loyalty is there. Again, you have families who have been there for many -- generations are still there. And they want the best, the best of what life has to offer. And they want so much for their children, you know? There are many, many, many challenges, as we know, you know, for all of us today. But those who are invisible and disenfranchised and disconnected from especially resources, you know, resources, job opportunities, you know, healthy 144:00options, not just services for illness, but healthy options, choices, information.

I was talking to someone who was doing some work with our parents. And she's a girl from Puerto Rico, woman from Puerto Rico. And when she was pregnant there was a mix-up with her insurance. And she wound up at a doctor's office on the Upper East Side. And she walked into the doctor's office and, you know, you had the water with, you know, the lemon and the lime. And you had all kinds of books on the importance of breastfeeding and certain kinds of dietary recommendations 145:00and exercise and vitamins and the development of the baby charts. And then when they realized that they had made a mistake with her insurance, they bumped her back to, you know, the "correct" clinic. And none of that was there. There was no information available. Of course, the customer service was curt and rude. And you're, you know, pretty much in and out, you know what I mean? So it drove her. I mean, she's since published, you know, and doing some really remarkable work 146:00with parents based on some of these experiences. But it's a small community, you know? Seven of those ten buildings was owned originally for PS 307, you know? There are only ten buildings. They're 3,200, right, families there. So it's a small community. And they loved what we were doing at the school because, again, PS 307 was a community school.

So every opportunity we had for parents to participate or to contribute, they would take. And we gave, you know, the kids so many opportunities to get on that stage because the auditorium became, I think, the most important space in that school outside of the teaching and learning that goes on in classrooms because 147:00that's where the community gathered to celebrate, you know? So we'd look for every opportunity to celebrate children, celebrate their parents, celebrate staff. It was wonderful. I think for some of the newer people who were coming in or looking at the school, I don't think they knew what to do with me, to be honest with you, you know, because I know who I am, and I know what I believe, you know? And I don't stand for a lot of foolishness, whether it's coming from a child or an adult, you know? But it was never about me, though. I said this to staff. "You'll figure me out. It is never about me." It has never been about me because if it was about me I wouldn't even be doing this because I'm a little 148:00introverted. People don't believe me. They want me to stop saying that. Really? Yeah, give me a break. But it really has never been about me. It's always been about kids, you know? It's always about kids. So I'm deciding what to do next, you know?

GOLIA: Well, that's -- oh, I was just going to ask you. I want you to tell me about your retirement.

DAVENPORT: So I retired in June, right, of 2015. And in October my home burned.

GOLIA: Wait, your Stamford home?

DAVENPORT: Mm-hmm. So there was a fire in October, right? It was bad enough through smoke that they had to demolish everything down to the studs. They took everything down to the studs. So I was displaced for a year. I had just retired. 149:00And there was no loss of life nor limb, right, which is a big thing. The rest of it, you know, my plan was -- because I had spent so much time in Brooklyn, I only went home on weekends and sometimes just on Sundays. But I spent most of my time in Brooklyn. And so, my home was pretty much a closet or a storage place, you know? I hadn't really done anything to turn it into a home. And that was going to be one of my priorities, right? So I had already started the process of downsizing, getting rid of stuff. And here comes the fire, and it's like, oh, really? So it wasn't a tragedy for me, you know? It was like wow. And so, the contractor said, "Okay, you have to get everything out." We had five days to get 150:00everything out.

So I had stuff in six different storage units, right, between Brooklyn and Connecticut. And but in the meantime, working with the contractor on -- so, "Roberta, what do you want? What kind of flooring do you want?" So I had the opportunity to build my new condo. And that was like, again, a new experience. And wow, who could have thought, right? So I picked up my keys a year ago this month, yeah? And it's beautiful. They did such a beautiful job. So I didn't have time to sort through stuff, you know, when I put things away. So now I'm in the process of creating a nest, you know, my home. And it's about ninety-five 151:00percent done. I'm down to one storage unit. Most of what's in it are books, you know? So trying to give some to the professional library at PS 307. And others I'm just kind of taking to the local schools in Stamford or donating to the library. I'm taking piano lessons. I bought a piano. I know it's been on my list. So that's fun. And reconnecting with family because I lost a lot of that when I was consumed with the principalship, you know? So I'm very much interested in my family and connecting with them, you know?

And then my own personal development, you know? Morningside School I mentioned. 152:00One of my important partners offered me a part-time position. So I had decided when I retired that I was not going to work, which I know a lot of my colleagues do. But I had no interest in working. I wanted to breathe, right, stop for a minute, and breathe. So I turned down things, you know? But when this came, I think in May, so Morningside had submitted a proposal to the Department of Education when President Obama was still in place. And it was funded. And because the work that they do with social and emotional learning is close to my heart, and I think it's lacking in too many places, I said yes. So this 153:00particular work is focused on racial bias, working with a particular district in Brooklyn. So I'm coaching. I'm coaching a principal. And it's part-time. In fact, I meet him for the first time next week. So it's an elementary school, a middle school and a high school. There are three coaches, and then the team at Morningside, an incredible organization doing really, really important work. So that's what right now I'm working. There's someone in Stamford who is running an after-school program. I asked him to send me the proposal that was funded, and it's extraordinary what they're doing. So it's not a typical after-school program at all. So he'd like me to do some tutoring in that. So I'm not 154:00committed yet. I'm thinking about writing, you know, doing a little bit of writing. And then my own personal and spiritual development is something that's really my number one priority. So a lot of things are going on with that as well.

GOLIA: It must feel like the first time in your life that you can actually --

DAVENPORT: You're right. I've never had this kind of time. I've been working since I was fourteen. I've never. And it's all good. I don't have any moments of "I need to be" -- no, it's a gift. I feel like it's a gift. But I also feel like I'm just getting started. I bought a rebounder, you know? So I -- it's a little trampoline. Yeah, so I'm working on a physical regimen, you know? I'm thinking 155:00about running, maybe. I'm starting with -- yeah, okay. [laughter] I'm thinking about it. I don't put too much stock in age as much as I put into the quality of life and the kinds of decisions that we make about how we want to live, you know? So I've been a vegetarian for a long time, although when I became principal I fell off the wagon because my hours were so crazy. And anyhow, that's all behind me now. But I'm back to, you know, being thoughtful about, you know, how I eat and what I eat and why I eat what I eat. Food has become so politicized, you know?

GOLIA: I mean, as you said, in Farragut, it is political, right? Access to healthy food is political.

DAVENPORT: Absolutely. So I am not so much being careful. But I don't want to 156:00say yes to everything, you know? But 12 years, you know, is a long time to invest. So I'm so happy that I still have my connections to so many of the wonderful people at the school. And I'm not on Facebook. I'm not. But you know, we meet for meals, and a couple of people have asked me to mentor, you know? I'm still figuring out what that means, to be honest with you. But it's still more about listening and sharing life experiences, you know? So it's a privilege to be able to work with young people in particular who have questions, you know, 157:00and need support, because I know I've had people in my life who have been instrumental in helping me to get to where I am today.

GOLIA: How are you doing? Because I have a few topics I would love to go back and talk about.

DAVENPORT: I'm good.

GOLIA: Okay, good. Do you mind if I go back in time a little bit?

DAVENPORT: Not at all.

GOLIA: I want to just -- I had a couple of questions that I wanted to flesh out a little bit. The first is, going back to growing up in Farragut; you described it as a mixed community. You described the diversity of it. Will you just elaborate on that a little bit? Tell me how diverse. Tell me who lived there.

DAVENPORT: Oh, Italians and Irish. You know, there was no 307 there. The building wasn't there, you know? So you had cobblestone streets, and streetcars were running. And we were out playing with everyone. It was so normal, in fact, 158:00that I don't have a recollection of anything unusual about it other than -- and this is in the '50s, right? At some point it changed, and it became all African American and Latino, you know? But there was a peaceful order there. Like I said, I don't remember any kind of physical conflicts. I never heard my parents or their friends talk about race. Diversity wasn't a word that was used then, but it was not a topic of conversation in our home. When I went to Assumption School, which was very diverse, I have no recollection of any -- you know, I was 159:00just shy at the time. Some things may have gone over my head. I don't know. But I don't have any personal recollection of any kind of issues around race. Again, everything was so normal.

When we went to church, everybody was at church praying. I mean, we didn't look to see who were the white people and who were -- you know? It was just how we lived. And then one day they weren't there anymore. And there was no discussion around that, you know, political or otherwise, you know? Up at the church, which was on Front Street, you have a row of houses, brownstones, brick houses going 160:00down Front Street. So some of the families that we played with lived there, you know? And in playing sometimes, especially those who are misbehaving, they would sneak out down to the waterfront area down where the F train is. And it was scary. I mean, it was nothing back there but factories and warehouses, right? It was nothing else back there. And then you had the church. I mean, if the church weren't there, we wouldn't have been back there. But even going down to the F train stop at York Street was scary because it was so isolated, right? And nothing was down there. What a difference.

GOLIA: Where was Assumption, specifically?

DAVENPORT: Assumption was on Middagh Street, mm-hmm. It was on Middagh Street, yeah.

GOLIA: I mean, it's so interesting because you were, like, early teens during the civil rights movement. Was that on your -- in the context of what we've been talking about, was it on your radar?

DAVENPORT: None. Again, I know my sister was -- my twin was very much in the movement, right? She was in the black student union at Hunter, right? I was someplace else. I was just someplace else. I was very much withdrawn. And like I said, my parents, we all came to the table for dinner. But I was not engaged in conversation and pretty much tuned out everything. I guess I was really odd and 162:00unusual kid. Yes, I can accept that. I can see, thinking back. So like I said, I think my brother, David, and Rosetta -- because David was the eldest. And Rosetta was my twin. I think they were more involved. I did always have an interest in spiritual matters. So at some point, you know, I wound up in Uganda at one point in my search and spent ten days in my mid-twenties. I was studying foods, food science, and alternative health practices and, you know, looking at 163:00spiritual practices and spent time down at the open center reading all kinds of things, you know? I was talking to people about Rosicrucianism.

So that has always been, it seems, a part of my life's journey, you know? And it was all connected, you know? Food in particular, you know, and the pulse, and looking at eastern practices, so that's why I mentioned earlier that if my father was around I would have loved to have had conversations with him. But anyhow, so I've had a very interesting life. So that's where I went. It was more 164:00kind of a universal people. We're all people of this Earth, you know, how important it is to protect the Earth, and kindness and, you know, who am I and why am I here became more compelling for me than what was actually happening in the outer world, you know? At one point I remember saying -- I've never said this out loud -- "stop the world. I want to get off," you know, because I didn't know where I fit, you know? So it's been this search for, you know, that question that we all ask, I guess, you know? Who am I, and why am I here, and all the rest of it. So that has been throughout my entire journey, yeah, not 165:00something I talk about.

GOLIA: I get that. I mean, it's hard to talk about.

DAVENPORT: Well, nobody cares. [laughter]

GOLIA: I don't know about that. [laughter] I mean, it's super interesting to me because if you take you and your sister, it is two really different but connected trains of thought from the '70s -- '60s and '70s, right? They're different. They're different routes. But they're both of that moment in a lot of ways, you know? So that's fascinating to me. So another thing I wanted to ask you about is, I've heard some fascinating stories about what Sand Street was like in the '50s and '60s. There were, like, tattoo parlors, and it was, like, a nightlife. Was that on your radar at all when you were a kid?

DAVENPORT: No. Wow, Sand Street?

GOLIA: Yeah.

DAVENPORT: Going up toward the Y? Going which -- up toward the Y?

GOLIA: Going towards the Yard, towards the Navy Yard.

DAVENPORT: Really?

GOLIA: Yeah.

DAVENPORT: Well, I told you -- now, I don't know what the boys did. I don't know what the boys did. But I know we were -- I was either upstairs -- I was very, very -- you know, I didn't know what was going on that was any kind of unsavory -- I don't know. My mom kept us away from that. So listen. We went to school. We went to church. We went to Girl Scouts -- "stay together, stay together," you know? I was home, you know? And that was my life. I didn't get off the block, really, until I started going to Bay Ridge High School and then, of course, going into the city, going to Marymount. So I was clueless when it came to those 167:00kinds of things, Julie.

GOLIA: I love it. I want to just come back to the rezoning question because it is -- I guess I'm trying to think about how to ask you what the question is. But you did so much change to the school. You brought so much -- the programs, a completely different approach, a different approach to just keeping up the building, the code of conduct. And then right when you leave, the rezoning. Do you think there's a connection there?

DAVENPORT: Someone said that there was. I think someone actually said it publicly at one of those meetings. That's what got back to me. I don't know what the answer is to that because, I'll tell you, when I left, I left. People kind of reach out. And then like I said, I had the fire. So I had some things that I needed to handle. And people wanted me to get involved. But you know, I was very 168:00conscious of the fact that there was new leadership in the building. And you know, I didn't want to -- because I didn't know what her -- so, see, I wasn't the principal. See, when I wear the principal's hat I can speak with a certain strength, you know? Right now I'm a citizen and not even a member of the community. You know, I was, but, you know, so -- because I can say what I say and walk away. Okay, it may sound nice, but you're gone, right? So this is about follow-through. And this is about being accessible and speaking, talking. See, 169:00this is when, to me, you do need the mic, see? And for the families -- because what's driving so much of those feelings of hostility or -- it's fear to me. It's fear and then unrecognized, to some extent -- and I guess another way of looking at it is recognizing biases, you know, that you individually have to handle.

But to me, again, this is where leadership comes in is that, understanding that, there still must be someone who will stand and speak on behalf of children and the school. And if we're getting away from that -- I mean, do you have a specific question? Because if you're getting away from, I don't want my kid to 170:00sit next to -- Shania [phonetic], you know? I don't want my kid sitting next to her. Exercise your option. I did say this before I left, though. I'm not begging anyone to come to PS 307. Listen, I had open houses. I was like this, always like this, right, open houses. "Let me tell you about 307. This is what we believe. This is what we do. This is why we do." And again, every child is of equal value. And then you make your choice like Nikole Hannah-Jones did, right? She made her choice, you know? So this is not begging you, please bring your little to 307. No, this is what we do. You want to get involved, that's fine. But this is a community school. When it comes to these kinds of situations, 171:00though, I am the principal. I've been the principal here for many years. We've had some success. You can ask me anything. Ask me anything.

But one thing I will tell you, I'm very clear on the direction that we're going. If you'd like to be part of that, we welcome you. We welcome every child who wants to be here. But I'm not bending over backwards. I'm not begging anyone. I'm not going to be intimidated or fearful. I don't care. Don't throw a politician's name at me. See, why did you take me here? You understand? Don't bring -- again, you have to stand up on principle. This is what leadership is, right? It's not so much when it's easy. When the road is easy, things are going along swimmingly. It's when the challenges come you find out what you're made 172:00of. It's a great opportunity to me. But listen, you know, we're not just, you know, haven't just been discovered because you decided you want to look in our direction. We've been here for a long time. And we've been busy. And you know what? There are people I can call to stand with us who's partnered with us, see?

So we stand as a united community, right? But the leadership is pulling all of that together because it's important for your parents, so the parents don't worry. It's important for the students themselves. You don't want -- "What's going to happen to us? What's going to happen?" It's important to staff. It's important to our friends and our community partners. Okay, here we go, the next 173:00phase. All right, we're going to make this work, right, working with the DOE, right? This can't be easy, you know? But again, we've had a lot of time to get ready. Maybe I should have stayed one more year, right? [laughter] Maybe I should have stayed one more year. But we had a lot of time to get ready. I wasn't a new kid on the block, you know? I'd been there, you know? I know the history, you know? We created the history. And again, we have a clear direction. So we're not going to call this a negative, right? We're not going to say that there aren't challenges. Of course there are. But certain things we won't compromise on. And we will not devolve this into some sort of what I call petty, 174:00negative assertions from parents who believe that there's some entitlement for -- that they deserve some sort of entitlement or they expect some sort of entitlement. Well, if that's the case, then it has to apply to everyone, everyone, okay?

GOLIA: Yes. Roberta, is there anything that I haven't covered that we should cover, that you would like to cover?

DAVENPORT: I think -- in closing, I think I would say I have lived a charmed life. I've lived a wonderful life with deep roots in a community in Brooklyn that has given me everything to establish a foundation, a firm foundation, for 175:00building a life that has brought me a lot of joy, satisfaction and fulfillment, personal and professional, you know? It's worth it to know, I think, that one is part of a community. And I think at the end of the day when we can talk about and feel connection, real connection, to our roots and the people who are associated with those roots and everything that comes in the development of one's life, you know, at the end of it all, you know, we're all connected. So I'm grateful. I'm grateful to Farragut and the Farragut community. I'm grateful 176:00to the progress that we see and the beautification of 11201, you know? There are wonderful things happening in DUMBO, wonderful organizations back there -- DUMBO Bid [DUMBO Improvement District], you know? -- who've done and are doing wonderful things for the community. There are so many partnerships and experiences that I haven't even touched on, I realize, you know, as I do this bit of reflection. So maybe I need to write that book, you know? But this has been a great opportunity, and I thank you for it.

GOLIA: Thank you so much. It was amazing to hear your stories. It really was amazing.