Angelo DeSalvo

ANGELO DESALVO: Hello.

SADY SULLIVAN: Hello, Mr. DeSalvo. This is Sady Sullivan.

ANGELO DESALVO: Okay.

SADY SULLIVAN: Uh, so before we get started, I just wanted to make sure, uh, to tell you about -- about the project and what the interview is for and sort of a little bit about oral history. So I know that we only have twenty minutes. So I'll -- I'll do that kind of quickly. So --

ANGELO DESALVO: Okay.

SADY SULLIVAN: -- um, then let me know if there's any questions. Um, so basically I will audio record this phone interview and then, uh, mail you a release form. And if it's okay with you, and -- and, you know, you like how the interview goes, then it will become part of the permanent archives at the 1:00Brooklyn Historical Society --

ANGELO DESALVO: Mm-hmm.

SADY SULLIVAN: -- and, uh, which is -- these archives of oral histories are accessible in the library here. And they're open to the public. And, uh --

ANGELO DESALVO: The library where? At Brooklyn?

SADY SULLIVAN: At the Brooklyn Historical Society.

ANGELO DESALVO: Oh. And where is that located?

SADY SULLIVAN: That's in Brooklyn Heights on Pierpont and Clinton Street.

ANGELO DESALVO: That's -- See, I don't know much about Brooklyn.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: I lived in the Bronx.

SADY SULLIVAN: Oh, okay. Um --

ANGELO DESALVO: And I -- And the only thing I know how to get to Brooklyn, down East River Drive and over the Brooklyn Bridge.

SADY SULLIVAN: Well we are very -- We're within walking distance of the Brooklyn Bridge.

ANGELO DESALVO: Okay.

SADY SULLIVAN: Uh, so pretty close to the water, like [inaudible]

ANGELO DESALVO: I won't be coming to New York anyway.

SADY SULLIVAN: Okay. Um, well -- And then the Navy Yard, the Brooklyn Navy Yard, they are doing an exhibit, uh, which is going to be in the Navy Yard in a building that they're renovating, an historic building. And they might --

ANGELO DESALVO: Building One?

SADY SULLIVAN: Uh, no, although I do know that one. It's, uh --

ANGELO DESALVO: Oh, seventy-seven.

SADY SULLIVAN: Maybe. It's this little brick building that's on -- [inaudible]

ANGELO DESALVO: No, that ain't it.

SADY SULLIVAN: Okay.

ANGELO DESALVO: That ain't it.

SADY SULLIVAN: Okay.

ANGELO DESALVO: Go ahead.

SADY SULLIVAN: Um, and so they're gonna have an exhibit that talks about everything that was built in the Yard from, you know, the 1800s 'til -- 'til it -- they stopped building --

ANGELO DESALVO: Oh, I don't go back that far.

SADY SULLIVAN: Oh, I know. Um, so I -- I actually did find out. I -- I looked back into my -- my notes and found that it was, um -- We -- we got your name as a suggestion to interview from Janet Walsh. Do you know a Janet Walsh?

ANGELO DESALVO: Yes. She's a lawyer.

SADY SULLIVAN: Okay. Um, well, she -- We were -- We -- I don't know how -- how the connection was made exactly. But we always put out --

ANGELO DESALVO: 'Cause I have, uh, lung asbestos.

SADY SULLIVAN: Oh, Okay. Okay. Um, so we -- You know, we put out the call to -- that we're looking for people who worked in the Navy Yard to interview for this project. And -- and she responded. And so, um -- So that's -- That brings us to 3:00the interview. Uh, basically I'll ask a little bit of biographical information, your name, where you were born, that kind of thing. Um, and then we'll talk about, uh, your work in the Navy Yard. And, um, if there's anything that -- you know, over the course of the interview that you decide afterwards that you don't want to become part of the archive, we can -- we can delete it or we can close it, you know, like, you know, this part, you can't listen to the interview for a hundred years, or whatever you want to do.

ANGELO DESALVO: Uh-huh. I see.

SADY SULLIVAN: Um, we can talk about that afterwards. Um, and, uh, so what do you think about all of that?

ANGELO DESALVO: Okay so far.

SADY SULLIVAN: Okay. Good. Um, well with that, I will ask, is it, um -- is it all right for me to start, um -- to start the recorder?

ANGELO DESALVO: Go ahead.

SADY SULLIVAN: Okay. Uh, so I will start the recording. And just for the -- do the formality, um. Today is April 28, two thousand --

ANGELO DESALVO: My anniversary.

SADY SULLIVAN: It is? Oh, happy anniversary.

ANGELO DESALVO: Forty-eight years.

SADY SULLIVAN: How many?

ANGELO DESALVO: Forty-eight.

SADY SULLIVAN: Wow, congratulations.

ANGELO DESALVO: Thank you. My bride is lookin' at me right now.

SADY SULLIVAN: Oh, that's wonderful. Um, and, uh, I'm Sady Sullivan with the Brooklyn Historical Society. This interview is for the Brooklyn Navy Yard Oral History Project. And so if you would introduce yourself to the recording.

ANGELO DESALVO: My name is Angelo DeSalvo.

SADY SULLIVAN: And what's your date of birth, for the archive?

ANGELO DESALVO: [date redacted for privacy]1931.

SADY SULLIVAN: Okay. And where were you born?

ANGELO DESALVO: The Bronx, New York.

SADY SULLIVAN: All right. And what about your parents? Are they from the Bronx?

ANGELO DESALVO: Uh, well both lived in the Bronx. Uh, my father was born in Italy.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm?

ANGELO DESALVO: My mother was born in the Bronx.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. And what's her -- What's her background, your -- your mom?

ANGELO DESALVO: What do you mean by background?

SADY SULLIVAN: Uh, like, where did her family come from?

ANGELO DESALVO: Her family came from Italy.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. Um, and so, uh, how did you come to be working at the Brooklyn Navy Yard?

ANGELO DESALVO: I, uh, was discharged from the Air Force after the -- uh, during -- after the Korean War.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: And I took out, wanted to get college credits to go to college. So I took up, uh, math courses in Modell [phonetic] Math Institute.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: And I was on the G.I. Bill at the time.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: And then my friend had heard that they were hiring in Brooklyn Navy Yard. So I went down and I took a -- a written test, passed it, uh, had enough experience in the Air Force that, uh, they -- I got a physical and I was hired.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. And what was the job that you were hired for?

ANGELO DESALVO: Electronic mechanic.

SADY SULLIVAN: And so what -- You had had, um, training to do that kind of job in the Air Force?

ANGELO DESALVO: Yes.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. And what year was that about?

ANGELO DESALVO: 1955.

SADY SULLIVAN: All right.

ANGELO DESALVO: October.

SADY SULLIVAN: And so what kind of work were you doing in the Yard?

ANGELO DESALVO: I was doing electronics.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: After the first year, I made electronics, uh -- I went from radio mechanic to electronics mechanic. And in 1962, I became a leading man.

SADY SULLIVAN: And what did that -- what did that job entail?

ANGELO DESALVO: Uh, electronics aboard ship, you know, um, checking out and -- 7:00Want to know the supervisor or when I -- when I was a mechanic? Which one do you want to know?

SADY SULLIVAN: Oh, um, sort of all of it.

ANGELO DESALVO: Well, as a -- as a electronics mechanic, I worked on several electronics equipment now onboard ship and -- and checkout and make sure that it was ready to go out to sea.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: And then when I made leading man, I was in charge and carrying maybe as much as forty men on the ship, doing electronic work and overseeing all the work being done properly and turning over electronic equipment to the Navy.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. Um, and so how many -- in terms of the -- the Navy being around, how many people were -- were Navy and how many people working there were civilian?

ANGELO DESALVO: Oh, mostly, uh, ninety-five percent was civilian.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: And the other five percent were, uh, Navy personnel, nothing to 8:00do with electronics. Uh, the electronics, we got involved with the Navy when the ship was ready to go out. And we kind of trained the sailors and, uh, shipboard people about the equipment.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. Um, and so what was -- Who were your -- Tell me about your coworkers.

ANGELO DESALVO: Like what?

SADY SULLIVAN: Um, you know, did -- did you all hang out after work? Was there camaraderie while you were working?

ANGELO DESALVO: Very, very, very much so.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: In fact, when I did get married, in '62, uh, I had about twenty men come, invited to my wedding --

SADY SULLIVAN: Oh, wow --

ANGELO DESALVO: -- with their -- with their wives. So I had, uh, several, I think, uh, three tables of coworkers at my wedding.

SADY SULLIVAN: Wow.

ANGELO DESALVO: And we used to hang out, like, uh, especially if we worked 9:00overtime and on a Saturday and, uh, there was hardly any people in the Navy Yard we -- quitting time we'd go. Instead of going straight home, we'd stop off at a -- you know, at a local pub and had a beer before we all went our different ways.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. Tell me about those, the local places. Where would you go?

ANGELO DESALVO: Oh, now you got me. [laughter] I don't remember. That was 1962.

SADY SULLIVAN: Right.

ANGELO DESALVO: I mean, that was 1955 to 1965 --

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: -- when the Yard was closed.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: So going back to '65, remembering name of places, no.

SADY SULLIVAN: Right. Right . Uh, but they were nearby? Like, it was within --

ANGELO DESALVO: Right outside the -- Right outside the Yard.

SADY SULLIVAN: Oh, Okay. Uh, might it been a -- might it have been on Sand Street?

ANGELO DESALVO: No. The other side of the Yard .

SADY SULLIVAN: Oh, Okay.

ANGELO DESALVO: Myrtle Avenue.

SADY SULLIVAN: Oh, yeah. Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: Myrtle Avenue jumps at me.

SADY SULLIVAN: Yup. That would make sense. Um, so I'm -- Let's talk about the, 10:00uh -- the sort of time before it was decommissioned. How -- Sort of how long was there talk of closing the Yard before it actually happened?

ANGELO DESALVO: Well as long as I worked there, when I went in 1955, they always said they were trying to close Brooklyn Navy Yard. And the older people that were there much longer than me said, "They've been trying to close us for a hundred years."

SADY SULLIVAN: Oh.

ANGELO DESALVO: But, uh, when it happened, it happened, uh, when Johnson was elected President. Before he was elected President, I think Bobby Kennedy was running for Senator.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: And one of his commitments was to keep the Navy Yard open.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: But then as soon as they were elected, the Navy Yard was announced that it would be closed. And it closed -- Let's see... That was 1968.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: No, can't be 1968.

SADY SULLIVAN: I think it was, um, between '65 and '66 that they --

ANGELO DESALVO: It was closed -- It was announced closed in 1964.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: And it closed in -- Well, I left in 1965.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: Uh, what was the reaction in the Yard to the announcement that -- of the closing?

ANGELO DESALVO: Very sorrowful.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: Very -- Everybody was downhearted, almost as bad as when, uh, President Kentucky was announced, uh, assassinated.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: Because, you know, there was a lot of people working there.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. Um, and what did people do when they -- when they got laid off or when they -- when it closed?

ANGELO DESALVO: Uh, I don't know.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: 'Cause, uh, I immediately put in applications for several places.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: And I was hired at Picatinny Arsenal eight months after I put in 12:00for different places.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: So once I left the Navy Yard, I didn't turn back.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. Um, and did you -- So did you pay attention to what was going on in the Yard the few years afterwards, like, in terms of the city trying to buy it from the Navy --

ANGELO DESALVO: No, I did not.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: 'Cause I was resident of New Jersey.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: I was livin' in Jersey. I was workin' in Jersey. I was through with New York.

SADY SULLIVAN: Right. Um, do you think -- Was it something that people who didn't work at the Navy Yard were aware of, the closing, I mean, like, other people living in New York?

ANGELO DESALVO: Maybe around the Yard --

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: aware that -- what was happening. But I don't think -- No.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: Just the families of the people that were affected, I think.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. Um, I've -- I've looked at some of the -- the newspapers from around then, and it looks like that there was, uh, some protests about 13:00closing the Yard. Did you --

ANGELO DESALVO: Oh yeah.

SADY SULLIVAN: Can you tell me about that?

ANGELO DESALVO: No, I can't. I wasn't -- I didn't participate.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. Uh, were you --

ANGELO DESALVO: I know there was, uh, busloads of people goin' down to Washington to protest the Yard's closure.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: I didn't go. I guess I was safe. I don't know.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. Um, what do you mean, you -- you weren't worried about --

ANGELO DESALVO: No, I wasn't worried.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: To find another job?

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: No, I thought I'd -- there would be no problem.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: I slept at night.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. Um, and were you part of a union?

ANGELO DESALVO: Yes.

SADY SULLIVAN: Uh, which union?

ANGELO DESALVO: When I -- When they closed, I was in the IBEW Local 3.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: That's why I wasn't worried.

SADY SULLIVAN: Right. And so --

ANGELO DESALVO: And if I couldn't work for the government, I woulda went -- 14:00worked for the -- for the union.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. And so they were helpful, the union was helpful?

ANGELO DESALVO: No, I -- 'Cause I didn't bother, you know? I wasn't -- I -- All I did is pay my dues. I really didn't participate. Or one time I went on a -- when the taxicabs had a strike, and I had -- they told me I had to go and picket --

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: -- one Saturday, that was my extent with the union --

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: -- other than payin' my dues.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. So the -- the -- I'm assuming that's because the taxi drivers were part of the union also?

ANGELO DESALVO: Part of a union --

SADY SULLIVAN: Oh.

ANGELO DESALVO: -- not IBEW.

SADY SULLIVAN: Oh, Okay. But it was sort of unions supporting each other?

ANGELO DESALVO: Yes.

SADY SULLIVAN: Okay.

ANGELO DESALVO: I would think so.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. Um, so what was the -- In terms of the -- the closing -- And you mentioned that, um, Senator Kennedy was -- was doing -- was trying to keep it open.

ANGELO DESALVO: Yes.

SADY SULLIVAN: What about, um -- What about the mayor at the time, Mayor Lindsay?

ANGELO DESALVO: I don't remember Lindsay doin' too much. You know, he was a Republican.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: And, uh, we had the Democrats on that -- on our side at that time.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: And, no, I don't remember Lindsay doing anything.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: He might have. Just, like I said, I used to go across that Brooklyn Bridge, you know, on the East River Drive and head out to New Jersey.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: 'Cause I was livin' in Jersey from nineteen -- oh, actually it was only one year. 1964 I moved to New Jersey.

SADY SULLIVAN: Ah. From the Bronx?

ANGELO DESALVO: From Flushing.

SADY SULLIVAN: Oh, okay. Um, what about other -- Did -- Did other changes and stuff, sort of political things going on during that time affect the Yard? Um, there was, Civil Rights and Vietnam and -- and all of that. Was that -- Did you feel that at the Yard?

ANGELO DESALVO: Civil Rights?

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: Not really, no.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: And Vietnam, I don't think Vietnam started. Started after.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: Or maybe the end of, uh, Johnson's term.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: Which the Yard was already gonna close --

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: '65.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: When did Vietnam start?

SADY SULLIVAN: I think -- Yeah, I think you're right. Although there was some -- like, some stuff going on in '64.

ANGELO DESALVO: There was some -- some -- some stuff, but not, uh -- not an all-out war.

SADY SULLIVAN: Right.

ANGELO DESALVO: As I remember.

SADY SULLIVAN: Um, and so was there -- What was the -- How did you see the Yard change in that -- in that, uh -- the ten years that you were working there?

ANGELO DESALVO: Well, the ten years? In ten years that I worked there? The change?

SADY SULLIVAN: Yeah.

ANGELO DESALVO: Didn't change much to me, except at the end, when the -- when 17:00everybody was hustling to find other jobs --

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: -- you know, with the government. I know a bunch of my friends went down to Washington, worked in the Bureau of the Navy --

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: -- Navy ships. And, uh, no, just -- just hustling around, trying to find a job.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. Did a lot of people, um, have to leave New York?

ANGELO DESALVO: Yes. The people that I know, worked in electronics, yes.

SADY SULLIVAN: Uh, where did they tend to go?

ANGELO DESALVO: A lot of them went down to Washington, like I said.

SADY SULLIVAN: Right.

ANGELO DESALVO: And some people I know went up to Rhode Island, and, uh, Connecticut, submarine depot in Connecticut.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: Uh, I don't know where the other one went.

SADY SULLIVAN: And so was that -- Um, was that something that people reacted to? 18:00Did they not want to leave? Did they --

ANGELO DESALVO: Did they -- did they want to leave Brooklyn?

SADY SULLIVAN: Yeah.

ANGELO DESALVO: No.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: At least I didn't want to leave Brooklyn.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: Um, not Brooklyn, Brooklyn Navy Yard.

SADY SULLIVAN: Right.

ANGELO DESALVO: I found it very rewarding job.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. Uh, what did you like about your work there?

ANGELO DESALVO: Well I was a leading man, and, uh, it was nice being able to supervise people. And also, I -- I went on a lot of sea trials. So it was very interesting, working on the equipment and going out to the middle of the -- the ocean and -- and havin', uh, planes and other ships come out, checkin' out your equipment.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. Uh, where would you do the -- the sea trials?

ANGELO DESALVO: In the ocean.

SADY SULLIVAN: Uh, like, pretty -- within -- Were they, like, one-day trips? Or how far out would you go?

ANGELO DESALVO: Well, some trips were one day and then some trips were six days.

SADY SULLIVAN: Oh, wow.

ANGELO DESALVO: It's not goin' far out. It's going out and staying out, having exercises with different, uh -- different, uh, like, cat -- uh, destroyers and airplanes and checkin' out all our equipment, not only electronics, but other equipment on the -- on the ship --

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: -- checkin' it out --

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: -- engines and all that, machinery.

SADY SULLIVAN: Um, is there -- is there one project that you're most proud of?

ANGELO DESALVO: Uh, one project I'm most proud of... Hmmm. Well I became, uh, carrier man. Most of the ships I was on was carriers, aircraft carriers.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm?

ANGELO DESALVO: And I enjoyed that because I no longer got seasick.

SADY SULLIVAN: Oh, because -- Explain that to me.

ANGELO DESALVO: Well, on -- on, uh -- On the -- I wasn't a Navy man. On the smaller ships, the destroyers and different ships like that, uh, I would have a tough time holding down what I ate.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: Where on a carrier, it was, like, on a floating island.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. So you didn't feel the movement as much?

ANGELO DESALVO: Not at all.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. Um, what were some of the biggest challenges at the Navy Yard?

ANGELO DESALVO: Oh, my challenges?

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: Gettin' the ship ready to go out to sea.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: And, uh -- 'Cause usually, electronics, we were the last group of, uh, civilians to leave the ship.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: I mean, after we signed off our equipment to the Navy personnel, we -- we'd leave the ship and we -- probably the last ones to leave the ship.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. Um, I'm noticing the time. It's been twenty minutes. So if --

ANGELO DESALVO: Okay.

SADY SULLIVAN: -- if you have to go, I understand. Although I have --

ANGELO DESALVO: I'll give you five more minutes. Then I gotta go.

SADY SULLIVAN: Okay, thank you very much. Um, so what are -- Was there any special events or particularly memorable moments, good or bad, um, you know, that would happen (overlapping dialogue; inaudible) --

ANGELO DESALVO: Uh, there were two. There were two very bad moments.

SADY SULLIVAN: Okay.

ANGELO DESALVO: The first one was when the, um, Constellation burned in the Brooklyn Navy Yard --

SADY SULLIVAN: Right.

ANGELO DESALVO: -- caught on fire.

SADY SULLIVAN: Right. And were you there at that time?

ANGELO DESALVO: No. Fortunately for me, I was out sick.

SADY SULLIVAN: Wow.

ANGELO DESALVO: And because, uh, the previous day, I was on another carrier in Bayonne during a, uh, like a ice storm.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: I had gotten sick. So when the carrier Constellation caught on 22:00fire, I was home watchin' it on television.

SADY SULLIVAN: Wow.

ANGELO DESALVO: But when I did get back, was allowed to go back into -- onto the ship, then I -- at that time, I found my toolbox was molded into one lump.

SADY SULLIVAN: Wow. So you would have been right down there.

ANGELO DESALVO: I hope I would have got out because some of the people -- some of the men that I was working with did get out.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: And we lost, I think it was thirty-eight people.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. And so did you know those folks who -- who didn't --

ANGELO DESALVO: No, I didn't.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: No. They were mostly machinists.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. And --

ANGELO DESALVO: And the other one was the, uh -- that this -- uh, President Kennedy.

SADY SULLIVAN: Oh. Tell me -- Tell me what happened.

ANGELO DESALVO: Well, we were onboard working. At that time, I was working on a small destroyer. And, uh, we heard somethin' 'bout him bein' shot at. So we -- being electronics, we set up a TV right away. And we got all the information. 23:00And that's where everybody, when they hearing, they stopped work, come listen to the television. And I don't think anybody was able to do any work the rest of the day.

SADY SULLIVAN: Wow.

ANGELO DESALVO: Ever seen grown men cry?

SADY SULLIVAN: Hmmm. Um, why -- Why -- I mean, I -- I understand. I'm just -- I would just like to -- to know, sort of have on the recording why is it that people felt, um, strongly about that.

ANGELO DESALVO: Well--um you know -- me, I personally thought he was a great President.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: And I expected a lot more things from him.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: But it didn't happen.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. Um, how did news like that, and -- and other news travel around the Yard?

ANGELO DESALVO: Well I don't know about the Yard 'cause the -- We were on the -- 24:00the, uh, destroyer. And then we stayed there 'til time to leave.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: So everybody was leavin'. And that's where everybody was talkin' about what happened --

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: -- as they were leavin' the Yard.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: 'Cause, you know, there was a lot of people in the Yard.

SADY SULLIVAN: Uh, yeah. At that time, how many -- how many people would you say?

ANGELO DESALVO: I would say, hmmm, close to nine, maybe ten thousand.

SADY SULLIVAN: Wow.

ANGELO DESALVO: That's what I I think that, you know, that's a long -- long time ago.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm. Um, so -- so when you -- in -- sort of in general, when you think about the Navy Yard, what -- what comes to mind when you remember working at the Navy Yard?

ANGELO DESALVO: My friends.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: And the work. I enjoyed the work.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: But mostly my friend.

SADY SULLIVAN: And do you -- do you keep in touch with anybody from that time?

ANGELO DESALVO: The ones I, uh, did keep in touch passed on.

SADY SULLIVAN: Oh. Um, and were those -- were they people that you knew before you worked in the Yard or you --

ANGELO DESALVO: No, no. No. No.

SADY SULLIVAN: Uh, so what was it about the atmosphere that -- that made for -- for good friendships.

ANGELO DESALVO: I can't explain it. Uh, you know, like the fooling around, the -- like, I remember one time we were on a night shift, night crew. And, uh, guys would come in to, you know, to put on their shoes and they find their shoes nailed to the -- to the -- a board or glued to the deck. They couldn't get their shoes off the deck. And running around, like, especially when the ship was almost done, and you're waitin' to sign off. And we had a lot of time. And you'd be walkin' by a compartment, somebody'd shoot a water pistol in your ear.

SADY SULLIVAN: So they were -- they were tricksters. [laughter]

ANGELO DESALVO: Yeah. Yeah. And I was in the middle, anyway.

SADY SULLIVAN: Mm-hmm.

ANGELO DESALVO: But when I became leading man, I tried to be conservative.

SADY SULLIVAN: Uh-huh. Was that a hard transition?

ANGELO DESALVO: No.

SADY SULLIVAN: Um, well, we've -- we've gone now another five minutes. And I appreciate your time so much. Thank you very much.

ANGELO DESALVO: Thank you.

SADY SULLIVAN: Uh, and so if -- if you could just tell me your address so that I can mail you the release form, and then, um, you can -- and I'll send you a copy of the interview. You can listen to it. And then if you want it to be archived, sign the release form and -- and mail it back to me.

ANGELO DESALVO: Okay.

SADY SULLIVAN: Uh, so what's your address?

ANGELO DESALVO: [address redacted for privacy] Toms River --

SADY SULLIVAN: Oops, I'm sorry. I didn't hear that.

ANGELO DESALVO: Toms River.

SADY SULLIVAN: Okay.

ANGELO DESALVO: New Jersey. oh-eight-seven-five-seven.

SADY SULLIVAN: Great. Thank you so much. And, um -- and happy anniversary to you and your wife.

ANGELO DESALVO: Thank you, Sady.

SADY SULLIVAN: All right.

ANGELO DESALVO: Fine. Bye-bye.

SADY SULLIVAN: Bye.