Leo Reitman

BENJAMIN FILENE: Some of this you've already told us, uh, when we talked earlier. But, um, what was your job at the Yard? What did you do?

LEO REITMAN: Uh, well, I was issuing, uh, supplies to the, uh, naval ships and the, uh, shops.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: That, uh, plumbing shop and electric shop. So, you know, I was doing that--I was in--

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: --working stationery supply at first. Then I went in hardware supplies.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: And, uh, issued such things as, uh, high pressure valves. Uh, pipe fittings.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: You know, plumbing things, valves and, uh, all sorts of, uh, parts, 1:00uh, for the, uh, uh, for the pipes like elbows and, uh, uh, gauge valves, and so on and so forth.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: Yeah, and uh, stationery was everything from pencils to, uh, uh, well uh, they had a, uh, tarpaulin up there which was sent to the, uh, uh, to the Yard through, uh, one of the factories where they, uh, made, uh, whatever it was they made. Masts or whatever.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: And uh, but uh, then uh, you know, our building was, uh, building number three and it was, uh, building number three and building number seven, both were supply buildings.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: We supplied everything from soup to nuts that the--

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm.

LEO REITMAN: --that the ships would need.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Okay.

LEO REITMAN: Ships and officers.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Why--didn't your button say number one?

LEO REITMAN: Uh, no, uh, that was the shop that I, uh, worked in, uh--

BENJAMIN FILENE: Oh. Within the building?

LEO REITMAN: Yeah, that was in the building. They--that was, uh, uh, uh, the--the 01 shop. That was the, uh, warehouse, warehouse shop.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Within one of the buildings.

LEO REITMAN: Yes, within that building.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Okay, I get it.

LEO REITMAN: I think they also had, uh, 01 buttons in some of the other buildings, including--

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: I think it was like more or less a classification button telling you that you were a laborer or, uh, uh, whatever.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm. Okay. Um, how long did you work there?

LEO REITMAN: Oh, I worked there from, uh. . . December 30th, 1940, till sometime 3:00in 1946.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Okay. Um, and how did you get hired? How did you first get the job?

LEO REITMAN: Oh, I put in an application, uh--

BENJAMIN FILENE: To the--

LEO REITMAN: For long--long time before, uh, the war ever started.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: And, uh, don't remember my number on the, uh, on the examination, uh, sheet, but, uh, anyhow, uh, they hired according to, uh, next in line.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: As to your grade. And, uh, that's when I was hired. December. And, uh, up until I, uh, was, uh, let go.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Okay.

LEO REITMAN: Uh, yeah.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Um, had you, uh, were you born in Brooklyn? Or had you--

LEO REITMAN: No, no, I was born in--born on the Lower East Side of Manhattan.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Okay. How long--when did you first move to Brooklyn?

LEO REITMAN: Uh, when did I first move to Brooklyn? Uh--

BENJAMIN FILENE: Roughly. I mean.

LEO REITMAN: About 1941.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Oh, so you started working at the Yard before you moved to Brooklyn.

LEO REITMAN: Yeah.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Yeah. Um, what was your, uh, how did you see the Yard before you started working there? I mean how--what did you think of it, um, from a distance?

LEO REITMAN: Oh, it was a massive thing.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Yeah?

LEO REITMAN: Yes. Immense. And, uh, well those days we had, uh, what do you call, the hammerheads. That's, uh, where, uh, this, uh, like a, uh, hoist. It can pick up almost anything , a ship, maybe it could even pick up a ship.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm.

LEO REITMAN: You know small one.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Yeah.

LEO REITMAN: Yeah. Anyhow uh--

That--that was one of the main attractions of the Yard.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Was the uh size of things.

LEO REITMAN: Yeah.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Um, well once you started working there was it a good place to work? Bad place to work? Uh--

LEO REITMAN: Oh. Very, very good. Those days everybody cooperated with each other. We had no, uh, such thing as, 'oh that's not my job'. Everybody coordinated.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Huh. Um, you mean they-- they would uh--

LEO REITMAN: Work together. You know.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Yeah.

LEO REITMAN: Everybody was jovial.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm. Was it a good place to work in terms of uh how--how were the salaries? Was--

LEO REITMAN: Well, salary was according to your grade.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Really.

LEO REITMAN: And, uh, yeah well at, uh, the time I think I received $25 a week.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: Something like that for 48 hours.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Wow.

LEO REITMAN: And it was considered good. It's a steady job.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm. So, it was considered good at the time?

LEO REITMAN: Yeah, very good.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm. Was there any particular advantage to be--to being, uh, working for the government?

LEO REITMAN: What?

BENJAMIN FILENE: Was it seen as an advantage or disadvantage to work for the government?

LEO REITMAN: Oh, it was--it was an advantage. Certainly. Uh, your, uh, you knew you were going to get your pay. And you had your vacation time and sick leave.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm. You didn't have much vacation time though, did you?

LEO REITMAN: Uh, I don't recall. Uh, I think it was, uh, uh, I--I think it was, uh, uh, uh, 26 days a year or something.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm. And you worked seven days a week or--or--

LEO REITMAN: Sometimes.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Sometimes.

LEO REITMAN: During the war.

BENJAMIN FILENE: During the war you did.

LEO REITMAN: During the war. Yeah sometimes, uh, I'd start work at 8:00 in the morning and, uh, uh, work till, uh, uh, sometimes we worked till 12:00, 1:00 in 7:00the morning.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Oh. Wow.

LEO REITMAN: Yeah.

BENJAMIN FILENE: So, most of the time--

LEO REITMAN: And get back to work the following morning at 8:00.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Yeah. Wow. So, a lot of the time you were there you were working--at least during the war you were working seven days.

LEO REITMAN: Yeah during the war. Not all the time. You know when--when it was busy. When things--

BENJAMIN FILENE: Oh.

LEO REITMAN: Uh, needed to be expedited. We worked seven days.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm. Was it--did you find that it was a, uh, particularly hard job or particularly easy? Uh, were you frantically busy all the time? Or were you able to, um, pace yourself through the day? Uh--

LEO REITMAN: No, no. We, uh, we had our, uh, uh, requisitions that we had to fill.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: And, uh, well everybody, uh, you know took, uh, took the--you know as--as the requisition came in, each one who finished their, uh, previous, uh, requisition would go pick up another one.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: And that's, uh, that--that filled a day.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm. But you weren't overwhelmed? Or--

LEO REITMAN: Well, no.

BENJAMIN FILENE: No.

LEO REITMAN: Never really rushed.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: But, uh, you know, you knew you had a job to do. And you did it.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Right. How was the place to work in terms of, uh, the conditions? Like the equipment. Was it safe equipment? Was it clean? Um, uh, things like that.

LEO REITMAN: Well, we all used to take turns sweeping the floor.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: And, uh, they had a, uh, custodian. Uh, uh, I would say the custodian. Now he was a, uh, a janitor who used to clean the bathrooms.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: Make sure that they were clean. And it was a good environment.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm. Um, did--did people switch jobs a lot at the Yard? You--you--you said you had a couple different things. But did uh--

LEO REITMAN: Well I, uh, I worked in, uh, uh, stationery department. And I 9:00worked in the, uh, uh, uh, plumbing--plumbing and--plumbing supply.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm. But did people change jobs a lot? Or were most uh--

LEO REITMAN: No, not necessarily. Wherever people were needed. And, uh, and they thought you were qualified, they would send you to do that job.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm. How about, um, you said it was a good place to work in terms of salary, and uh, uh, cleanliness and things. Um, how did people get along with the, uh, management? I know you had a pretty elaborate system of supervisors and--

LEO REITMAN: Yeah.

BENJAMIN FILENE:--supervisors of the supervisors. Uh, was there--how did the people get along with them?

LEO REITMAN: Well, in my department it was, uh, very good.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: What happened on the outside in the other shops, that--that I 10:00couldn't say.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Sure, yeah. Well you--you showed us um a lot of your suggestion uh sheets. You know you filled out a lot of those. Um how much of a say did--did workers have in what was going on at the shop?

LEO REITMAN: Well, it was any suggestions that were made went to a, uh, awards committee.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: And the committee--the committee on awards would uh evaluate the suggestion and uh see whether it was worthwhile.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: Adopting or not.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: And if they thought it was, uh, worthwhile, they would send it over to the, uh, commanding officer. And he would evaluate from there on.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm. And who was on the committee of the awards committee?

LEO REITMAN: Uh, no, no, he was the chief.

BENJAMIN FILENE: No. Who was?

LEO REITMAN: Huh?

BENJAMIN FILENE: Were workers on the committee?

LEO REITMAN: Workers. Workers.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Only workers?

LEO REITMAN: Only workers. Yes. And, uh, various, uh, shops.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Were there--oh. So, from all the shops. Or from--

LEO REITMAN: Well uh.

BENJAMIN FILENE: All the shops in the building?

LEO REITMAN: Uh, no it wasn't just on our building. And, see, and I don't recall exactly how many people we had on the committee. But, uh, it--it was a select--it was a selected committee.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm. Was there one committee for every building or something or--

LEO REITMAN: That I don't know. I know that, uh, we, uh, I think all suggestions came in through suggestion boxes.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Uh huh.

LEO REITMAN: Placed in, uh, various buildings.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: And then they were brought over to the circle awards committee.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Oh, I see. So, there might have been only one committee.

LEO REITMAN: Yes. One, just one committee.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Oh. So they--

LEO REITMAN: As far as I know.

BENJAMIN FILENE: So, they'd have to deal with suggestions from the machine shop, the packing shop.

LEO REITMAN: Right, yeah.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Yeah, okay. I see.

LEO REITMAN: And if, uh, if we were in doubt, we'd go out, uh, send the 12:00committee to, uh, inspect, uh, the suggestion.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm.

LEO REITMAN: Uh, inspect the suggestion.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm. That's interesting. Well, were there other worker committees like that? Other types of things besides suggestions that the workers were involved in?

LEO REITMAN: That I don't know.

BENJAMIN FILENE: So that was the main one in your experience.

LEO REITMAN: Yeah.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Yeah. Because that's an interesting idea that the workers should be involved in, uh, in what's going on.

LEO REITMAN: [inaudible]. That's right?

BENJAMIN FILENE: Yeah. Um, a lot of the time you were there was during the war. How did the war, uh, affect the city of Brooklyn? I mean most generally. How was it--if you're walking around in Brooklyn, how would you know that it was wartime? How were things different?

LEO REITMAN: Well, uh, you wouldn't see too many people out on the street because both men and women were working.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm.

LEO REITMAN: Uh, almost everybody except women with, uh, small children couldn't 13:00go to work.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: But otherwise everybody was involved.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm. Were you working with women in your shop?

LEO REITMAN: Yes, there were a couple of, uh, women, women.

BENJAMIN FILENE: What--what types of jobs did the women tend to have?

LEO REITMAN: Well, the same, uh, same type that the men had.

BENJAMIN FILENE: There was no distinction?

LEO REITMAN: No. We--we had women welders.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: And--and we had women in the plumbing shops. All--there were women all over.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm. So what was it like working with them? Was there--what was your first reaction when you started working with women?

LEO REITMAN: Oh, uh, well, uh, actually for, uh, you would think, uh, that you would have to, uh, do their job for them and, you know, because things were heavy. You know heavy, [inaudible] heavy, uh, material. And, uh, we thought, uh, at first we thought well we're going to have to fill in for them.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Uh huh.

LEO REITMAN: But it didn't work out that way. They handled their own jobs.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Huh. That's interesting.

LEO REITMAN: Uh.

BENJAMIN FILENE: So was there any resentment, uh--

LEO REITMAN: No, not at all. I mean, they were--

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm.

LEO REITMAN: Once we found out that women can handle their jobs everything was, uh, back to normal.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm. Um, well back to the war. How did it feel to be, uh, able to work instead of getting drafted? What was the feeling on that?

LEO REITMAN: Uh, well, uh you--you were still, uh, considered to be on the, uh, well you yourself would consider yourself, uh, to be on the firing line because you were doing your--your best at the time.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm.

LEO REITMAN: Even though, uh, you hadn't, uh, been called for, uh, uh, actual service.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Right. Right. Like the man behind the man behind the gun.

LEO REITMAN: That's correct, yes.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Yeah. I was reading about that. Um, so do you think, uh, maybe people wanted to get drafted? Or did they feel that they were, uh, in a good 15:00position where they were? Or uh--

LEO REITMAN: Well, people who were working at the Navy Yard, uh, a lot of them were drafted. It didn't exempt you from, uh, the draft.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Oh no?

LEO REITMAN: No. You had your classification, uh, when you were called, you'd go down to--

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: Uh, the drafting board.

BENJAMIN FILENE: So were people content to, uh, keep working? I mean, did that seem like--

LEO REITMAN: Yeah sure.

BENJAMIN FILENE:--that was better than being drafted? Or, uh, or--

LEO REITMAN: Well, uh, that was--matter of fact, uh, when my younger brother was killed in the war, in the war.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Oh--

LEO REITMAN: And, uh, my, uh, uh, my number had come up for the drafting, I, uh, you know, was hoping that even though I had, uh, two children, I was hoping to get into the war so I could get back at the enemy.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm. Wow.

LEO REITMAN: See, that's, uh, I was exempted, and I had reached the age of 28 at that time.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: And uh, they said, well, we don't need you.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm. How were the, uh, naval workers viewed by the community as a whole at the time? Did you get any impression of--of how people--how people viewed Navy Yard?

LEO REITMAN: How people viewed the Navy Yard?

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm. People who weren't working there.

LEO REITMAN: No, not really. No.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Okay. Well, was there any pattern as to who got drafted and who didn't?

LEO REITMAN: No pattern.

BENJAMIN FILENE: No?

LEO REITMAN: No pattern that I know of.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Because I heard that some people were, um, some people were exempted.

LEO REITMAN: Oh yes. People who, uh, had problems with their ears or heart, eyes.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Uh huh. But were some people exempted because of their jobs? That's what I heard.

LEO REITMAN: Yes. Yes.

BENJAMIN FILENE: What kind of jobs got exempted?

LEO REITMAN: Well, uh, doctor, and uh, well, uh, well, a lot of doctors, were, 17:00uh, uh, drafted. But, uh, I think if they wanted to--I--I really don't know what the rule was at that time. I don't know whether they could have, uh, uh, asked for the exemption or not.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm. Hm.

LEO REITMAN: I couldn't answer that.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Okay. Um, was there any sense of, uh, that what you were doing at the Yard was secret or classified, or you shouldn't talk about it, or anything like that?

LEO REITMAN: Well, uh, we would get, uh, uh, what is that, uh--cables where it would be specified, uh, this is, uh, you know, I wouldn't say, uh, secret, or 18:00anything like that, but, uh, uh, it was a, uh, uh, a sign, uh, on there, that, uh, it would be, uh, to expedite this material.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm.

LEO REITMAN: And, uh, but uh, well, actually nobody--I don't think anybody ever talked about what was going on.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Really.

LEO REITMAN: Yeah. In other words, it was, uh, uh, normally known that, uh, you don't talk about the job.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Huh. How do you think they--how do you think people got that idea?

LEO REITMAN: That I don't know. It was an unspoken, uh, rule.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Huh. So, did you ever, um, question or speculate about, uh, what your work was being used for? Did--

LEO REITMAN: No, I knew what it was being used for.

BENJAMIN FILENE: How do you mean?

LEO REITMAN: Used for, to supply the ships.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Okay. So, all right. That's what I meant. I mean, you didn't--did you know specifically what everything was, uh, heading for?

LEO REITMAN: No.

BENJAMIN FILENE: No. So, you--but you just had a series of requisitions that you had to fill.

LEO REITMAN: Yeah.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Okay. Um ,how long did you work at the Yard after the war? A year or so? Or--

LEO REITMAN: Well, I, uh, worked there I think until 1946.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Right.

LEO REITMAN: And, uh, well the war ended in, uh, '45.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Five, right.

LEO REITMAN: Yeah. So--

BENJAMIN FILENE: Year or so.

LEO REITMAN: Yeah--

BENJAMIN FILENE: How did, um, how did things change at the Yard after the war in the year you were there? Did you notice a big difference?

LEO REITMAN: Well, yes. Uh, there were a lot--a lot of people, uh, who, uh, were either transferred to other, uh, stations or, uh, just, uh, uh, resigned because they thought they were no longer needed. They'd go out and earn more money or whatever.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Oh really? Were the salaries better outside the Yard?

LEO REITMAN: Yes, yes.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm.

LEO REITMAN: But the, uh, the Yard tried to, uh, uh. well keep within a certain percentage of the outside.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm. So why would people want to stay working at the Yard if the salaries were better outside?

LEO REITMAN: Because it was a steady job.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Okay.

LEO REITMAN: If you were civil service, you know.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm. Um, what did--

LEO REITMAN: Not--not everybody was civil service there.

BENJAMIN FILENE: No?

LEO REITMAN: No. No. Not everybody was classified civil service.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Were most people or--or--

LEO REITMAN: See, uh, a lot of people worked there per diem.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm. Yeah.

LEO REITMAN: Yeah, and uh--

BENJAMIN FILENE: I see. So, civil service people probably had more permanence, stability. Security.

LEO REITMAN: Yes, they had, they had different classifications.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm. Um, and then you were let go in '46 because they had too many workers?

LEO REITMAN: Yes. That's right.

BENJAMIN FILENE: What did you do next?

LEO REITMAN: Uh, next, I, uh, uh, went into the grocery business.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Oh really?

LEO REITMAN: Yeah.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Did you, uh, set up your own, or did you, uh--

LEO REITMAN: No, I--I bought a, uh, little, uh, shop.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm. In Brooklyn?

LEO REITMAN: In Brooklyn, yes.

BENJAMIN FILENE: What was it like, um, what was it like working outside? I mean, was that a big transition?

LEO REITMAN: Oh yeah. Well, uh, it was in the same, uh, line. Um, I was, hm, ordering supplies and selling supplies.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Yeah.

LEO REITMAN: It worked.

BENJAMIN FILENE: You were experienced at that.

LEO REITMAN: Yeah, right.

BENJAMIN FILENE: But, uh, did you find, um, so, if you were doing similar skill, using similar skills, uh, how was it different working outside than inside the Yard?

LEO REITMAN: Well, uh, there was, uh, after I, uh, sold my shop, I went to work, 22:00uh, somebody else. Well, it was a different atmosphere. It wasn't, uh, even though you did your job--

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: There was somebody always on top of you more or less.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm.

LEO REITMAN: You see?

BENJAMIN FILENE: Yeah.

LEO REITMAN: And uh, uh, uh well, if you didn't produce, they would get somebody else to replace me.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Uh huh. And how was that different at the Yard?

LEO REITMAN: Different at the Yard? You worked at, uh, at, uh well, at, uh, let's say at the amount of the requisitions you had.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: You tried to complete all the requisitions for that day and naturally there are some days you couldn't complete all the orders.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: And, uh, would have to leave it for the following day.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: That's, uh, well, I'll tell you, a lot of, uh, during the war requisitions kept coming in so fast, it was very difficult to try to keep up with, uh, filling them out.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Uh huh. Yeah, I bet. So how was that different from the idea that, uh, once you're outside you always had someone on top of you watching you and--

LEO REITMAN: Well, no, you--you, uh, not that they really would be watching you.

BENJAMIN FILENE: No, but checking up on you.

LEO REITMAN: But uh, but uh, well uh, uh, they--they would always try to prod you to produce more.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Uh huh.

LEO REITMAN: Uh, whether you were working at top speed or not. They figured they can always get a little bit more.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Was that different from the Yard?

LEO REITMAN: Yes, very much different.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Well, why? Why? What did they do at the Yard that was different?

LEO REITMAN: Well, nothing. I mean, uh, you, in the Yard, you did your job. If you didn't do your job, supervisor would, uh, uh, ask you why, uh--

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: Why you couldn't, uh, fill out any more orders than you did.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: Because every requisition that you filled out you had to initial.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: And, well they would check up on how many you did.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm. But was it less, uh, they were watching over you less than they did outside?

LEO REITMAN: Yes, because they--they knew you were going to do your job.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Okay. All right. Um, how--how were your relations with your, uh, coworkers? Were you friends with them on the job?

LEO REITMAN: Yes.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Yeah?

LEO REITMAN: Yes. Yeah. Everybody was, uh, friendly.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Did you, uh, I mean did you know them outside of work?

LEO REITMAN: Uh, like I said, uh, everybody cooperated with one another.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: So, if somebody had something where that was too heavy for him 25:00to--to--or her to, uh, handle they would call for somebody else to, uh, give them a hand.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm. Did you know their--uh, did you know them outside of work? Did you know their families or uh--

LEO REITMAN: No, not really, uh, when you finished the day's work you went home.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Right. Right. It was. . . tired.

LEO REITMAN: Yeah.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Um, was there a sense of unity within the building? Like was the, uh, packing shop, um, did it see itself as a cohesive group versus the machine shop, or--

LEO REITMAN: Well, yeah, uh, you know, like, uh, if you would, uh, see somebody a number of times and even if you didn't know them, you'd say hi or something like that.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: Like in the old farm countries.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm. Okay. Um, but there was--was there any sense of friendly competition between the shops? Or, uh, anything like that?

LEO REITMAN: That, I don't recall. There's something in the back of my mind 26:00there but it's so long ago I don't remember.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Yeah. Okay. I was just wondering because, uh, seemed like there'd be sort of a team atmosphere or something.

LEO REITMAN: Yeah.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Um, how about, uh, racial or ethnic, uh, minorities working at the Yard? Were there--

LEO REITMAN: Well we--we had, uh, other--other than white. We had, uh, people from, uh let me see. . . I know I had some Cubans working with me at the time.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: And then there was, uh, a, uh, man, uh, from, uh, what do they call it, whether it was Honolulu or whatever.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm.

LEO REITMAN: You know, one of the Pacific islands.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm.

LEO REITMAN: But, uh, everybody got along.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Everyone got along? Um, were there certain jobs that, uh, that certain ethnic groups seemed to do more? Like were the blacks doing the same jobs as the whites? Or were more of the blacks in one division than another? Or--

LEO REITMAN: No, no, no I think--I think, uh, we had one black working on my floor.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: And, uh, we all got along.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Did--were you doing the same work?

LEO REITMAN: Same work.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm. Yeah, I was just wondering. Um, did--did you socialize? Did people socialize with each other, um, or did people sort of group into little, uh--

LEO REITMAN: No, no, no, we were all together.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm.

LEO REITMAN: All, uh, all, we were all a team.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Okay. Um, how do you feel about uh what's happened to the Navy Yard since you worked there? Um, a lot of changes have gone on. There've been a lot of ups and downs economically.

LEO REITMAN: Yeah, well uh, the, uh, navy, uh, abandoned the Yards. They--they--

BENJAMIN FILENE: Right.

LEO REITMAN: Uh, now the city of New York has taken it over and, uh, I mean it was granted to the city of New York. And, uh, city of New York is going to build it up, uh, to something [inaudible].

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm. How did you feel when the Yard left, when the navy left?

LEO REITMAN: Well, I felt a little depressed because I figure the longer you have the Navy Yard there, uh, we can do something if--if in case of an emergency.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Uh.

LEO REITMAN: Same as the, uh, I forget what you call it, Bush Terminal, and you had, uh, well supplies and the, uh, also, uh, they used to transport, uh ,soldiers over there.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm. So, you meant that in case of a--what kind of an emergency? A uh--

LEO REITMAN: Well in case of, uh, a, uh well, a war or--

BENJAMIN FILENE: A military--

LEO REITMAN: Yeah. Military emergency.

BENJAMIN FILENE: So yeah. So, you're a little--was there any, um, were you bitter or resentful? I mean, who--did you feel that it was just sort of inevitable that the Yard had to leave? Or was it someone's fault? Or uh--

LEO REITMAN: Well, it was nobody's fault. The, uh, uh, Secretary of State, or whoever is involved in that, uh, thought that, uh, the--

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN:--navy didn't--doesn't need that, uh--

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: The station anymore.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm. How--what about, um, like you were saying the city of New York is taking it over, and they're trying to get private, um, firms to build it up again. Uh, do you think that is feasible? Or do you think it, um, could serve 30:00the same function that the Yard did or that the Navy Yard did in the city?

LEO REITMAN: Uh, well, you know, the Navy Yard even though we had the, uh, had the hammerhead or whatever but, uh, we also had, uh, uh, the, uh, outside, uh, builders. Shipbuilders building ships. We also supplied them with materials.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm. I didn't know that.

LEO REITMAN: Yeah, well that, we supplied them with materials that, uh, uh, they required to build ships. If they couldn't get it on their own, I imagine. Then, uh, we supplied them.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm. So, do you think the, uh, that private firms today could, um, fill the role that the Navy Yard used to fill in the economy? Or--

LEO REITMAN: No, I--I, uh, I think the, uh, Navy Yard, uh, was--itself the 31:00better, uh, supplier. Because people feel that--that they're doing something for the government.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm.

LEO REITMAN: See where out in the private, uh, sector well I'm working for my boss, I'll do so much, and so on and so forth.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm. That's interesting. Yeah. Um, how about, uh, so that's the economic side of it. How do you think the private companies can fill the role that the Navy Yard did in terms of a--I don't know, a symbol or social, uh, place or, um, a place that Brooklyn took some pride in. Um, things like that. Do you think once the area gets going economically again that again there'll be the 32:00same sort of pride? Or was the Navy Yard pride different?

LEO REITMAN: Well, I don't know if they can put the Navy, uh, Yard together as, uh, you know as a--well, the Navy Yard as far as I know was always there--

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm hm.

LEO REITMAN: In terms of how long it took them to put it together in the prior years to my coming to the Yard,uh , well, I don't know. They did a good job, the Navy Yard was there and people came to work there. Well, to fulfill their job, or be useful--

BENJAMIN FILENE: Okay. That's great. Thank you.

LEO REITMAN: Pleasure. If you need any more, uh, you know sources.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Yeah, I do.

LEO REITMAN: Yeah, I would suggest get, uh, uh, to the local newspapers in various states and cities. Asking anybody who worked in the Navy Yard to, uh, 33:00to, uh, you know, send in their, uh--

BENJAMIN FILENE: Because that's how you found out about it, right? Was through--

LEO REITMAN: Yeah, I found out from the, uh, Daily. There was a little article in the Daily News, uh--

BENJAMIN FILENE: Right. Right. Yeah. Yeah, that's the--

LEO REITMAN: Take Los Angeles.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Yeah.

LEO REITMAN: Take, uh, uh, Phoenix, Arizona. Take Chicago.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm.

LEO REITMAN: Uh, Florida, a lot.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Yeah.

LEO REITMAN: Get into the--the local papers.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Yeah.

LEO REITMAN: You know what I mean?

BENJAMIN FILENE: That's true.

LEO REITMAN: Like, uh, the Bay News. You've heard of the Bay News?

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm.

LEO REITMAN: Flatbush Courier, things like that.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Mm.

LEO REITMAN: They'll give you free advertisement.

BENJAMIN FILENE: Hm. That's--that's a good idea.